Kevin Morris: Leak-free Solution for Meeting Codes - PODCAST TRANSCRIPT

Editor's note: The following is the transcript of a live interview with Kevin Morris from Tubos. You can read the interview below or listen to the podcast.

Intro: Welcome to Roofing Road Trips, the podcast that takes you on a thrilling journey across the world of roofing. From fascinating interviews with roofing experts to on the road adventures will uncover the stories, innovations and challenges that shape the rooftops over our heads. So fasten your seat belts and join us as we embark on this exciting roofing road trip.

Karen Edwards: Hello and welcome to another episode of Roofing Road Trips from RoofersCoffeeShop. My name is Karen Edwards, and today I am welcoming Kevin Morris from Tubos. Kevin, welcome.

Kevin Morris: Good morning, Karen. Nice to see you again.

Karen Edwards: Yeah, it's nice to see you too. So Kevin, could you just for those listening who maybe have never met you before, introduce yourself and tell us a little bit about you?

Kevin Morris: Well, I actually got into the roofing industry when I was 14. I started working full-time at my uncle's sheet metal shop on summers. And so I learned the basics, making end caps and vents and just copings and stuff like that. I did that for a while and then when I turned 18 and went into the Marine Corps for a few years, four actually. And then when I got out, my uncle came back to me and asked me if I'd like to learn the business side of it. And of course that was of interest and I was still going through college and stuff. And had to re-familiarize myself on the floor with the guys and cut and sheet metal. And little by little, I'd say, well, in about a year's time I was running the business full time. And I did that for about seven years and that's actually what led me to meeting my now partner, Rick Maddox. He was one of my customers.

Karen Edwards: Oh, interesting. That's very cool because you had a customer, you build a relationship and then you started a business.

Kevin Morris: Yeah, exactly. Well, it went hand in hand because we used to make roll steel for him and that's kind of where we came up with the idea for it because there wasn't anything on the market for vent pipe extensions I.e. Tubos. So I used to roll steel for him and he had a job up in Mississippi. I think there was 117 short pipes on it, and that just got us talking. We realized that the way we were doing it was very time-consuming, costly and there had to be in a better way. So that's where we are, well, now with Tubos but we started that in '09 and been doing it ever since.

Karen Edwards: Wow. So you were before coming up with the idea for Tubos, just forming the metal to create your own pipe extension?

Kevin Morris: Yeah, it was the same concept. We rolled steel, it acted like an insert. You put that down in the existing pipe and then you'd have to get PVC from the hardware store, then put it over, notch it, put it over top of that, pretty time-consuming. There are other methods too like the no-hub coupling, which we didn't like because if you didn't torque it down accordingly, it would leak. And if you had it below the roofline in the insulation, then you'd have a headache in the future trying to find that problem and then fixing it. So we decided that there had to be some kind of prefabricated pipe extension, and we came out with the design we have now with the double-sided. And you can pick your length because every part of the roof's different. If you have a tapered system or pouring lightweight or whatever you might need, six inches over by a drain and you might need 12 inches closer to the wall or what have you.

Karen Edwards: I'm curious though, you said 117 on that first, that job and that was the inspiration really behind, what kind of time savings are we talking about? What would it have taken to the way you were doing it versus just having a prefabricated solution?

Kevin Morris: Well, you'd have to send your guy to the metal shop instead of your roofing distributor. You'd have to then also get PVC from the hardware store. So you guys are getting off the roof and walking around in the AC'd Home Depot for a while, taking their time, getting pieces and hopefully getting all the pieces. And then when you have to put them all together you're looking at, depending on if it's no hub or the steel, it's 20, 30 plus minutes per each pipe. And then you got to still flash it accordingly. With ours, you basically insert one end of the tubos in measure up to the height you need, cut it and then you flash it like you would, works on any roof system as well. So you're looking at two to three minutes versus 20 to 30 on each one.

Karen Edwards: Wow. Yeah, that's significant, especially if you have a roof that has 117 pipe extensions on it.

Kevin Morris: Yeah. And if you are looking at schools and medical facilities or any building that has a lot of plumbing, that's not unusual.

Karen Edwards: Now, you've got options when it comes to width, what are those options?

Kevin Morris: We make four sizes right now, two inch, three inch, four inch and five inch. We have had some requests for an inch and a half. And if you hear this and you do need those that size, that or a six inch, as long as we have the demand we can manufacture it. The problem is we have to extrude these pipes to make a certain ID and OD, so it's not something we can just put together. We got to have the demand for it. Those four sizes are the most popular. So that's what we're running with right now. You get the bigger sizes more up north with snow conditions, and down south more of the twos and threes and then of course the occasional one and a half which we're entertaining.

Karen Edwards: Okay. Always obvious question, where do you get tubos?

Kevin Morris: Well, we sell through distribution only. We have some online stores that seem to do really well. They sell them individually if you just need a handful of them. But we sell them through all our major distribution, the ABCs, Beacons, Suncoast, Gulfeagle and then we also sell through some plumbing distributors as well. We did entertain getting plumbing reps and roofing reps at the very beginning, and we found that probably 90% plus of our sales went to roofers. So we've focused almost entirely on the roofing side of it and it's worked out well. And we're even on Amazon now, so it is pretty easy to find.

Karen Edwards: Excellent. Now, I know that you and I have had conversations before about the performance and the warranty. And you've had no warranty claims, have you?

Kevin Morris: No, zero. 16 years we've never had one returned to us. It's all on the design. It is super heavy duty PVC. It's Schedule 60, the white extension part and even the red insert is Schedule 40. It's got UV protected in the white PVC. If there's any exposed, it's going to be fine over time depending on the type of flashing that you do with it. And then it is design, again, the red insert acts as a downspout. The way that it's sealed it will not leak. And it diverts water down into the existing pipe instead of the roofing system. So not only will it not leak, but it's almost impossible to install wrong. So it's almost roof for proof, if that's a thing.

Karen Edwards: Oh, that's funny. Yeah, if it's easy to install then that's the first step. So you recently have made adjustments in the thickness of the insert. Tell me a little bit about that and why that change was made and maybe what impact that would have.

Kevin Morris: Yeah, the only time we do get any kind of concern it is if the insert reduces air flow. One thing I always remind our customers, whether it's a contractor or specifier, is the lead boots that people have installed over top of these plumbing stacks for over 100 years. That being pushed down into the top of the pipe has never affected the flow of the ventilation, and it's not going to affect the methane gas being released. It's just a gravitational draw. But we made it from a 0.185 to a 0.150, which is Schedule 40 still. So it's definitely sturdy enough, but we wanted to open it up just a little bit more. And again, 16 years we've been doing this and we've never had any issues with that. But that is the only concern that does come up. And almost every time that I do remind the customer about the lead boots, it kind of eases any kind of hesitation on using the product.

Karen Edwards: And are tubos being used in Canada, US, outside the North America, what are you seeing?

Kevin Morris: Yeah, we do sell in Canada, not a lot. The market's a lot smaller, the roofing market as a whole. And plus we're still a fairly small company. We have a lot of market share left in the United States, and that's our main focus. We have a lot of territory still untapped. And I think when going after the Canada market, that's something we would want to partner up with someone that's already established in the area that maybe our line goes hand-in-hand with some of their roofing lines or accessories. I think that would be the best way to go about that in the future. But right now, our focus is still in key territories in the United States. We've sent some down to South America too. It's just with shipping and customs and all that stuff, it's really not on our priority list, I guess would be the best way to put it at the moment.

Karen Edwards: That makes sense. Yeah, and this is one of those products that I feel like when you're talking to a contractor and they learn about it, do you see that light bulb go off in their head like, oh my gosh, this is going to be a game-changer for me.

Kevin Morris: Yeah, not only that, I've had a ton of contractors say that I thought of that 20 years ago. We hear that a lot. Oh, I thought of that a long time ago or why didn't I think of that of course? But yeah, I've never left a meeting to where I feel like the contractor wasn't fully on board with it. Like I said, there's really no [inaudible 00:11:08] as to why you wouldn't want to use it. It just makes sense. So that's what got us through the beginning in the recession, it wasn't a matter of if it was going to work it was a matter of when. It was tough starting in '09, especially selling a new product that's never been on the market. So we're selling something that really no one's even looking for because they don't know it exists. So as a matter of educating the contractor or even the specifier or everybody, just letting them know that it's out there. Distributor too, because they don't want to bring in stock on a product if they don't have sales already, which they're hopefully going to also create sales as well.

But it was hard to get them stocking. And so we had to get creative, and that's kind of when we learned our first big specifier was the US Postal Service on a national level. And when we realized that respect on the post office, we realized that that's what we need to go after, school districts, medical facilities. Any kind of specifier architects, that's our main focus and they sell it for us at every pre-bit. So without any competition and being in the specs, it's a win-win, I guess the best way to put it.

Karen Edwards: Yeah, that's the sweet spot. And explain the reason why the pipes are needing to be extended. It's a code issue, correct?

Kevin Morris: Yeah. Any opening on a roof or even a vent or anything else for back up flooding, it is mainly on flat roofs. It got to be eight inches minimum, so water's not flooding back into the building if it gets up above. And that goes with anything on the roof. So some areas it has to be higher, sometimes they want it up above the parapet wall and that's why we made it so it can be stacked. Some places needed it up four or five feet, and we have some pretty good pictures where they would use to do it with no-hub couplings. And eventually they would lay over on the roof once they got loose or the sun would deteriorate. But yeah, you can stack ours as high as you want. And with that insert again, it makes it extremely stiff and it'll last forever. The white extensions you'd be protected so you can stay out exposed to the sun. So yeah, it's all on design, that's been the success for us.

Karen Edwards: Yeah. I love the story of a product that has been developed to solve a specific problem. And you said when you talk to people they're like, "Oh, yeah, well, I've had that idea." But you don't often see people that make it happen, and you were able to do that and that's pretty cool. Congrats.

Kevin Morris: Well, a lot of times people come to me with ideas too and it has to be really vetted. Rick and I, we spent over a year looking at all the ins and outs and seeing if there's anything else out there that could throw us off, any kind of building codes or anything that could give us a headache going forward. And we really didn't find anything or find any reason why it wouldn't work.

Karen Edwards: It takes time, it takes effort, it takes research, it takes energy. You don't just launch a new product overnight. And the testing and the approvals, and there's a lot that goes into this. And just like you said, '09, if you remember, you know that '08 was the start of that recession, so it took a lot of stick-to-it-iveness and effort on your part to make this work. And I think that's really impressive. As well as the fact that you've had zero returns, zero problems, it doesn't leak, it lasts forever. You don't see that too often, so I think that's pretty impressive. So congrats to you and your partner.

Kevin Morris: Well, thank you very much. Yeah, they say that less than 1% of patents ever make money. So it is something that you have to really do your research before moving forward, because getting the patent and getting the moldings, anything that you have to do you have to test it and test it and test it. So it's very time-consuming, very costly. So you want to make sure you do your due diligence before running with a product. But so many times I hear that people come up with this or that, and they don't go with it and it's something they'll always regret. So do your research and give it a shot.

Karen Edwards: Give it a shot, that's right. Oh, well, that's awesome. Well, Kevin, thank you so much for being here today and for sharing your story and the story of Tubos. I think that was really interesting. And I want to thank everybody out there that's listening to this. And you can go to rooferscoffeeshop.com and just type in Tubos in the search bar. And you'll see their full directory with contact information, where to find them and how to get in touch. Kevin, again, thank you for being here today.

Kevin Morris: Thanks for having me, Karen. It's always a pleasure.

Karen Edwards: All righty. And stay tuned because we've got more episodes coming up. We hope to see you on a future one. And why don't you just follow us on social media as well, because then you will not miss a thing. We'll see you next time. Bye-bye.

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