Shattering Silos: Transforming Roofing - PODCAST TRANSCRIPT

Editor's note: The following is the transcript of a live interview with Monica Vornbrock and Melissa Chapman of The GLO Group. You can read the interview below or listen to the podcast.

Heidi Ellsworth: Welcome to Roofing Road Trips, the podcast that takes you on a thrilling journey across the world of roofing. From fascinating interviews with roofing experts to on-the-road adventures, we'll uncover the stories, innovations and challenges that shape the rooftops over our heads. So fasten your seatbelts and join us as we embark on this exciting roofing road trip.

Hello and welcome to another Roofing Road Trips from Roofers Coffee Shop. My name is Heidi Ellsworth, and I have to tell you, we have a special episode today. Two of my dear friends I've worked with with so many years and are doing something truly unique, and I'm going to say revolutionary for the roofing industry. So I'm super excited for this episode. I am very, very proud to introduce Monica and Melissa from The GLO Group. Welcome, ladies.

Monica Vornbrock: Hi.

Melissa Chapman: Thank you. How are you?

Monica Vornbrock: Thank you.

Melissa Chapman: So happy to be here.

Heidi Ellsworth: I'm so happy to have you both. I love what you're doing. It's so cool. Let's start with some introductions for those few people out there who don't know you.

So Melissa, why don't you go ahead and introduce yourself, tell us about the company and what you do?

Melissa Chapman: Well, I'm Melissa Chapman and I am co-founder of The GLO Group, and we are a brand engagement and organizational health firm. What that means is we work with organizations to help them identify what is causing some misalignment within their organization and preventing them to really perform at their best.

And so we provide different kinds of support, resources, workshops, coaching. All kinds of services to help organizations really streamline their processes, align their people. And really get behind who they are, what they are doing and how they really provide value for their customers.

Heidi Ellsworth: I love it. I love it. This is such good stuff, so Monica, please introduce yourself.

And then can you give us a little bit of the history of how you and Melissa came together with The GLO Group?

Monica Vornbrock: Absolutely, so I'm Monica Vornbrock. I am the other co-founder of The GLO Group. And the reason that we started The GLO Group is we worked in marketing for many years in the roofing industry in different capacities and we noticed a repeating a pattern that we kept encountering over and over every time we worked with our clients.

And that was that all these initiatives were implemented, all these marketing efforts were put forward. All the money that they were spending, but the team internally wasn't communicating. So a lot of times, a lead would come in and then they would say, "Hey, did you close on that lead?" And they'd be like, "Oh, I thought this person was doing that."

And the other person thought they were doing that, so that miscommunication reflected in their bottom line, in their sales. Their customer experience was not consistent. So if they had multiple locations, the team, they weren't singing the same hymnal. They weren't communicating the same way, and they weren't treating the client the same way.

So we thought, "This is a great opportunity to create synchronicity and to create alignment internally, so that we can start from the inside out." That's how we came together.

Heidi Ellsworth: Well, and we've all worked together in different companies and in different capacities. I'm just like, "Yes, yes. I see and saw the exact same things."

Melissa, what are you seeing today overall in the industry? And what are some insights around what you guys are talking about with culture and brand, and bringing it all together?

Melissa Chapman: Well, it's interesting because you've got, for contractors, you've got the field and then you've got the office. So right there in itself, you've got different priorities and different agendas. And then within the office, each department can have their own goals.

And oftentimes, not all of the elements of the organization, all the pieces that make the puzzle fit are really working, like as Monica said, in sync with one another. So everyone has different priorities. Perhaps the field, they don't understand the impact of the choices that they're making on the office and vice versa.

So there's a disconnect. And oftentimes, that creates frustration, that creates a lot of finger-pointing. So what we're finding is that when we bring everybody together and everyone has a chance to understand how to be more effective in their communication, how to really be active listeners.

Collaborate more on problem solving and understand that there is a ripple effect for everything that you do. Once that awareness comes forward, then there are tools that can be created or developed. There are methods and processes and ways in which that organizations can become more aligned, and as a result, become more effective.

Reduced callbacks have increased profitability, happier customers. Overall, happier employees too because you're removing redundancies, you're eliminating, reducing frustrations. You're providing a forum where people can actually have a conversation and it's not confrontational. It's more solutions based.

You're addressing the issue and not the person, so that's what we help organizations address. And it's pretty common actually, especially because you have that separation of field and office.

Heidi Ellsworth: I think it's everywhere. Every company I've worked in, I've seen it. Especially between sales and marketing, between sales and marketing and operations. Definitely when it comes to finance, think about all those expense reports. There's this contentions until you really understand each other and understand that everybody has a job to do and they're doing it to their best.

So I'm really proud to say we are working with you and we have had such a great experience. You always want to say of your own company, "Well, oh, that's not happening here," although I knew it was. Because there's always finger-pointing and there's always people become passionate about their different things and create silos.

And even with a company as small as Roofers Coffee Shop, which is 30 people, there still were silos that we are working through that just kind of happened, maybe human nature, I don't know. But what are you seeing with the silos effect? I just think that's such an important part.

And maybe, Monica, you can start us off on that, just those silos of all those different things we just talked about. Boy, they can just bring the whole organizational culture down.

Monica Vornbrock: They can, and it's interesting because they can come from multiple directions. You can have silos are created because of technological gaps, because of generational gaps, cultural gaps, internal miscommunication. You have different locations, geographical locations.

But then also what's interesting, is that it's not just people that are working remotely and not seeing each other in the office. It's also people that work in the same office, in the same department are not aligned in the goal and how they work together and how they contribute to the overall picture, so that creates silos.

A lot of independent workers, people that come from different companies, you bring in your culture. You bring in the way that you do things, and you make it your process. You don't think of, "Hey, how does this affect the next person?" So it's crazy how the amount of redundancies that can be created from silos, the frustration, like Melissa said.

As well as time wasted, because sometimes they're not using the platforms correctly. There's people spending five hours looking for information that already exists somewhere, but it was in the CRM and nobody read the notes in the right place, and they don't know where to go. So you have people recreating the wheel multiple times, and it's a time suck.

Heidi Ellsworth: Yeah, it really is. One of the signs for me that, and we're constantly trying to work on our culture. Because no matter, even if everything's great, you should still be having conversations because you never know what's there.

But one of the big signs for me was finger-pointing, when you start having people do finger-pointing. Melissa, what are some of the other signs that companies should be aware of to realize that, "Hey, you've got some silos, you've got some communication issues going on"?

Melissa Chapman: Usually, you'll see it if there's a slow adoption to a new process that you're trying to implement, or a slow adoption to technology. Those are really very loud signs, if you will, but softer signs could be just disengagement. There's this term, quiet quitting.

It is a real thing where people are kind of, "Well, I'm just here. I'll do the bare minimum and I won't go above and beyond." Well, that impacts the whole organization. You're only as strong as your weakest link, so you'll see things like that. You'll see people not responding to other people or not contributing in a meaningful way.

You feel there's this underlying current of frustration and underlying current of, "What are we doing? I'm here. Am I just collecting a paycheck? What is my contribution? What is my purpose?" Those are the kinds of things that will surface when there's that misalignment and those silos happening.

Heidi Ellsworth: And that's when your retention starts going out the door.

Melissa Chapman: That's right. And recruitment, it affects recruitment as well.

Heidi Ellsworth: Yeah. Sometimes I think every organization has to be aligned around the goals and sometimes it just doesn't. An employee and the organization just do not align and that's okay, but overall, you want to make sure at least you're communicating that and putting it together.

So one of the things that I have found so cool and actually is really helping, is that you all provide tools to be able to start speaking the same language, to be able to start having those conversations.

And so when you're looking at that impact of communication and collaboration, talk to me about those tools that you all are bringing to these companies to help them work through that. Maybe, Monica, start us out.

Monica Vornbrock: Sure. I think it all starts with self-awareness. It all starts with a leader that says, "Okay. How am I going to help my team?" And acknowledging what's happening around me and how can I improve it? Even if you're doing things right, there's always room for improvement, so that's the first thing. It's having someone that wants to make their team more aligned.

With that comes, we bring in everybody together in person, which in itself, helps people that have never seen each other, people that don't work together on a day-to-day capacity. But also then we bring tools to help them through team development activities, through different breakout sessions and things that we do in our workshops.

That allow for people to test real-life challenges and what they're going through. And we create a safe space where they can bring in any issue that they're having, constructive criticism and just feel like they're being heard and valued, and that they're contributing to the solution.

Melissa Chapman: Yeah. Some of the tools that we do, like you mentioned earlier, it doesn't matter if there's a language difference. We did a workshop recently and they felt that the language was going to be the issue in this team building activity to demonstrate leadership.

That the language was going to be the barrier to being effective, but it actually wasn't the language, the different languages that was the issue. It was the style of communication. So when we work with folks, we help teach them a vernacular so that everyone is speaking a common language that they can reference.

Then because it's that universal language that they can reference, it then helps remove some of the emotion that would be related to a regular conversation. It becomes then more fact-based, more issue-based, rather than personal-based or individual-based.

Heidi Ellsworth: And I also think you give tools for people to know themselves a little bit better.

Melissa Chapman: Absolutely.

Heidi Ellsworth: So if they know themselves a little bit better, it's easier to communicate in that less emotional way.

Melissa Chapman: Yes, exactly. It's that self-awareness. And it's also, as Monica mentioned, it's bringing that self-awareness that's not just for the leader, it's for the whole team.

The self-awareness of the impact of your communication style, and the awareness of what your team, what they need in terms of communication, for it to be the most effective interaction with one another.

Heidi Ellsworth: Yeah. Okay. As we know, ladies, we are in a male-dominated industry, and so I want to bring some of this, as I said, we have done this workshop with you. It's been highly successful. We have a lot of generational, and in our group, we have men and women, but we're a media group. It's a little bit different than construction, roofing, more male-dominated.

How is that, how is it bringing what some people would call softer skills, but something that is so critical right now, how's it been for you as a company to really work with the field, to work with contractors? Melissa, I'd love for you to start us out like how are you bringing this to the more macho world?

Melissa Chapman: Well, surprisingly, it's been great. Truthfully, men aren't really taught these soft skills in general. If they have been, they've had either amazing women in their lives that have helped them there, but generally speaking, men aren't really thinking about how they're crafting their messages. So it's been really well-received and so appreciated, to be honest.

We had this workshop, I guess, it was a month ago, and the four men were hugging us when we left, because they were like, "You have no idea. Thank you so much. This was so helpful." They didn't recognize, it's like they don't take the time to have that self-awareness perhaps, and so it's been really well-received. It is a foreign concept out of the gate.

But as we unfold it and as we incorporate real-life situations, it's like the light bulb goes on and everyone's like, "Oh my gosh, this makes perfect sense. Yes, this will make a big difference for us." And you can see the results immediately. It's not something that takes time. You can really, from the moment we're finished, you can really see results happening immediately.

Heidi Ellsworth: Now, you've been doing this for a number of years, but really have this huge focus last year going into this year.

Okay. So we all know, especially owners, it doesn't matter what gender you are, but owners, our bottom line, what's the ROI on this? What is this really going to bring back?

And so Melissa finish, kind of take that that one step forward. You can see it immediately, but that's softer. What are companies seeing for return on investment?

Melissa Chapman: Well, after year one, we survey our clients before and after, and we continue to survey after. And after year one, we found that 92% of our clients have seen an increase in profitability. We've seen 64% of improved employee morale, an increase in recruitment, retention. We have lots of statistics, but ultimately, increased profitability, increased revenue.

Ultimately, happier employees, who then help become your recruiting team and your referrals. They bring people in because they're like, "This is a great company to work for. Your voice is heard and you're seen. You can contribute and you're valued." That really goes a long way. As an organization, if you only rely on the paycheck, on the dollar to differentiate yourself, you're going to get a short-term person.

It's more than money. People need more than money, they need purpose. They need to feel valued. They need to feel part of something bigger than themselves, and so that's what we help create.

Heidi Ellsworth: When you think about the cost of recruitment, right there, that number alone could pay for everything. Because every time you lose somebody, whether they are quietly just doing their thing and not really being engaged or whether they quit and go somewhere else, you are losing money.

Also, if someone quit and go somewhere else, now you got to spend the money, new training, a lack in productivity, all of those kinds of things. So Monica, the companies that you've all been working with, when you're really looking at the recruitment issue and, I guess, bigger retention issue, what are you hearing from them?

Monica Vornbrock: Well, one of the highlights to go into the things that they are saying to us and the things that we are seeing. Is that not only are they retaining these employees, these employees are now recruiting, helping them recruit, which is amazing.

Because now you're bringing people in that are within that culture and within that group of like-minded individuals. Because your people are now thinking, "Hey, who do I want to work with? Who would help grow this? Who would go in the same direction as us?" So that's one of them. The other thing is the morale, the employee morale.

When you start losing people left and right, your employees notice it. They feel it, they see it. So when you're able to keep employees long-term, that weight that they have on their shoulder every time they have to train somebody. Because realistically, you hire people, but your employees are training the people that you're hiring.

Heidi Ellsworth: Right.

Monica Vornbrock: A lot of companies don't have the correct onboarding in place, so they're like, "Hey, you take them over and you take them out to the field and you teach them the ropes."

Well, if that happens 10 times in a year, that person that's teaching the ropes is going to get discouraged and upset. And that's time wasted for them that they could be using their skills in something else, so it goes beyond just the recruiting. It also goes into the internal morale.

Heidi Ellsworth: Yeah.

Melissa Chapman: Also, what we've seen is those individuals that really embrace this transformation essentially, really elevate themselves within the organization. They become the next layer of leaders.

It naturally creates a stronger bench so that you can have upward mobility. Create growth paths for your employees within the organization, which ultimately that's what you want. That's your succession planning right there, so it contributes to that as well.

Heidi Ellsworth: We've already seen that. We've already seen it, and it's just that opening that communication. You think the communication's open, but there is so much room for improvement all the time. Plus, it's just a busy world, and so even if you think as an owner that you have it all figured out, or your company's just going great.

I can say from experience, if you slow down for a little bit and just start asking a bunch of questions, all of a sudden you'll go, "Okay, we need to spend a little time here. We need to do a little tweaking or a little helping out." So as an owner who's listening to this, or anybody in a company who's like, "Oh, I wish we had this. We have so many silos and we aren't communicating."

What's the first step that a company should take to really start evaluating what they have going on and what to do next, Melissa?

Melissa Chapman: I think it really begins with leadership. It really begins with the leader who believes that we could be better than where we are right now. And I know we can be better, I just don't know necessarily how to get better. And then them having a team that also believes we want to be better, we just don't know how. It's that desire of wanting to grow, it's having that growth mindset is the first step.

If you have that, if that's something that you desire and you see that there's an issue. Having those conversations with that leadership team saying, "Okay, what are we seeing? What are our challenges? Is it taking too long for the guys in the field to adopt this new technology? Is it taking too long for project completion to invoicing? Where are our challenges and identifying what they are?"

Also, being aware of where do you want to be? What in a perfect world, what do you want to look like? What does that image look like? Describe it. That would be the first step, because we can help you get from where you are to where you want to be. But you have to really be honest with yourself to be clear on where you are, and understand the challenges that you're facing.

It does take a bit of humility and vulnerability, but that's how you're going to grow. They say, "If you're uncomfortable, then you're growing. You don't want to be comfortable." So that's really where you want to start.

Monica Vornbrock: You want to look at the monetary cost, because all of these things cost the company money. The time that's being wasted, the initiatives are not succeeding, all that is costing money.

So not only the awareness, not only the, "Hey, how do I fix it?" It's look at it, convert it into dollars and then you'll see how it relates directly to the bottom line.

Melissa Chapman: That's true. Yeah, what's the risk for not doing anything? What's the financial risk for not doing something?

Heidi Ellsworth: Yeah, and I just think there's so much to be said for being proactive and being ahead of it. So we're an EOS company, so we work on the goals, we work on the vision, we do all of the processes and all of that stuff. But you still, there's that connection you have to make between the leadership of the EOS and the company overall.

And if you let it go too far, you're going to start jeopardizing your customers, which then now you're really, not that customers are more important than employees, even Steven out there, but you don't want to lose customers.

Melissa Chapman: No, and if you have happy employees, you're going to have happy customers. It's just that's what's going to happen. So you look at Nordstrom as an example. That has been their motto the entire time, and look how successful they've been, so there's proof to that.

There are organizations, large and small, that have measured, there's a direct correlation between employee satisfaction and revenue and profitability. There have been multiple studies published, so you can have all the best processes in place.

But if you don't have the people buying in to the overall vision, feeling valued, understanding the why, it's not going to make any difference. It's not going to move the needle enough for you to see significant growth. You're going to be checking the box essentially.

Heidi Ellsworth: Yeah. So I think this is one that all three of us can relate to. But if you're not an owner, and maybe you're not even on the leadership team in your company, but you're listening to this podcast and you're like, "Yes, this is a problem. I see it." I have to say, all three of us have been in that situation that I just described.

That's a hard thing to do. It's hard to approach leadership. It's hard to take that step to start those conversations in a way that do not make people defensive. So Melissa, what's some of your advice or tips to people out there who really see this need, who love the company and want to see improvement, but they really need to get this in front of the right people to start moving the meter?

Melissa Chapman: I think you start with asking questions. It's not necessarily telling someone that there's a problem. It's more about asking questions to highlight, "Okay, what are the goals of our organization? Do you feel that everyone is clear on those goals? How do you measure that? If you feel that everyone is, how do you know? How have you measured that everyone is clear on those goals?"

Asking the questions of, "Do you feel that all of us are aligned in what your vision is, Mr. Leader or Mrs. Leader, or whatever?" Asking the questions, I think, is a way to start the conversation, because not only will you gather information in terms of from an edification perspective. But also it provokes thought and conversation, rather than, "We're not doing this right," because that's not really constructive.

It's more about being curious, like trying to understand, "Okay, what are you trying to accomplish? Is it working? How do you know it's working? Okay, and if you don't know, then maybe we should find out if it's working. If it's not working, well then what are we doing to try to make it work?"

Heidi Ellsworth: Right, right. And Monica, on the flip side, as a leader and obviously in my shoes right now, trying to get that commitment from your crew because we're all so busy, we're all there's so much.

And so all of a sudden, now you're like, "Okay, we're going to take this time out and we're going to learn to communicate." You can just feel and see the eyes rolling, whether you're in front of them or not.

What's some of your advice to the leadership to really get that engagement from the employees to take this on as a joint effort?

Monica Vornbrock: I think the first thing is acknowledging that there's going to be some team members that are going to be afraid because speaking out is scary. They think, "Well, am I going to get in trouble if I speak out? What's going to happen?" So being able to come to your team from a very open place and saying, "Hey, I'm going to participate because it is very important that as a leader, you walk the walk."

So being able to say, "I'm going to be a part of this as well, and this is going to be a learning experience for all of us. The goal is X, Y and Z, whatever we're trying to achieve, the alignment. I want to hear from you. I want you to feel valued, and this is going to help you be the best version of yourself that you can be and the team work together the best that they can."

So I think it takes a little bit of, "Hey, I'm in it too. I'm going to walk this walk with you. We're all walking in together."

Heidi Ellsworth: I think that's such a great point. I've had a couple of aha moments that some of the team members are just like, "Didn't you already know that?"

I'm like, "Not only did not I know it, but let me say this again because I'm thinking you didn't really know that either."
But we all make these assumptions, and as leaders or as employees, we assume and that really can lead to even more silos because of those assumptions.

Melissa Chapman: Right. Yeah, the human condition is to look at things through our own filter, so it's a natural thing. What we're trying to bring forward is the ability to say, "Okay. There are a lot of words and phrases that are ambiguous and could mean something to one thing, to one person and an entirely different thing to another person."

So having that clarity, having really clear communication and that's not one-sided. Communication, it's a dialogue. It means that there are more than two parties involved and everybody has to be on the same page for it to be effective. So what does that look like? Just because you say on time, well, on time to someone could be two minutes after. On time could be two minutes before, and on time could be right on the nose.

Heidi Ellsworth: Right, right.

Melissa Chapman: So it's really creating an environment where everyone creates clarity around terminology, so people can show up more intentionally in what they're doing.

Heidi Ellsworth: Yeah, I agree and I've seen it. I'm going to right out there say I'm seeing this growth. I'm seeing it's going to take time.

It's not something you one and done. It's a constant going forward, communication styles, just constant-

Melissa Chapman: That's a really point because this is not like a magic pill that you take and you do, it's like a one and done.

No, this is like a long-term, transformational commitment of, "This is how we are going to show up for each other every day, because this is what's going to make us great individually and collectively."

Heidi Ellsworth: So for those who want to start their transformational journey, I love that, transformational journey.
How do they get started with The GLO Group and how does this work? Monica, why don't you start us out and Melissa can bring us home.

Monica Vornbrock: Sure. So currently, we're offering a free consultation for all the RCS customers. For that, you can either email letschat@GLOgroup.com.

Or at the bottom in your episode notes, there will a link to be able to fill out the form and schedule a consultation.

Melissa Chapman: Yeah, and anytime. If people are just curious, schedule that consultation, come with your questions. We'll answer whatever it is you have.

And we'll identify if we're the right match for you because we may not be the right fit, and that's okay. But I think taking advantage of that 15-minute brief consultation will be a great way to start.

Heidi Ellsworth: It's a great way. That's how I started. I sat down and said, "Hey."

Monica Vornbrock: If you're one of those people that are not a leader yet, but you can resonate with this, we do also have one-on-one coaching services as part of the side of the things that we do at The GLO Group.

So we do have support and we are able to help out. Hey, well, how can we help you spread the news and spread the good feel around your team? So you don't have to be a leader to work with us, but to do a workshop and all of that, then yes, of course, then you would have to be a business owner.

Melissa Chapman: Right, and I want to point out also is that we have been trained as certified professional coaches. We say there's so many "coaches" out there, but we actually do have the education and certifications.

So that's what makes us a little bit more unique as well, because we are trained to facilitate in a way that doesn't necessarily... We are your partner in helping you achieve your goals. We don't lead you, we're your partner. We're walking side by side with you.

Heidi Ellsworth: Yeah, I love that. So for everyone out there, you can find all this information in The GLO Group directory on all three coffee shops. For our club members, I just want to say it's actually a 30-minute consultation. We also have Melissa and Monica are involved in our quarterly peer groups around culture and HR and all of that. So as in our club member, as always, you just get a little bit more.

But for everyone coming to any of the coffee shops, you're going to find this 15-minute consultation. And if you just go to The GLO Group or letschat@GLOgroup.com, just mention Roofers Coffee Shop, they'll take care of you.

Monica Vornbrock: Absolutely.

Heidi Ellsworth: But however you get there, I don't even care. I just want you to get there because it's such a great experience. Thank you.

Melissa Chapman: We do this in Spanish too. So don't forget that if you have a team that speaks Spanish, bilingual, we can do multi-language workshops.

Heidi Ellsworth: Which is extraordinary. Yeah, that's the future right there. That is awesome. Yeah. It's one thing to have problems communicating when you're all speaking the same language, then you add one more layer on there.

But like you said, it really comes down to communication styles at the end of the day. So ladies, thank you so much for being on today. We're going to do more of this, so we'll have some little deeper topics coming up, but we wanted to get the big picture out there.

Monica Vornbrock: Thank you, Heidi.

Melissa Chapman: Awesome. Thanks so much, Heidi.

Heidi Ellsworth: Thank you, and thank you all for listening. This is the stuff that's going to grow your business, so be sure to share it with your company, ask us questions, send us information and definitely get together with The GLO Group. Check out their directory on all the coffee shops.

Also, check out all of our podcasts under our RLW navigation on all three sites, under the podcast, whether it's Roofing Road Trips, Coatings Cast or Metal Cast. Be sure to subscribe and set your notifications so you don't miss a single episode. We'll be seeing you next time on Roofing Road Trips.

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