No registration for Texas roofers.

I have no idea why this can not get done because everyone seems to want it, but the bills to require roofer registration in Texas failed to even get out of committee. So, once again, evil roofers are free to prey on gullible property owners (key sarcasm) at least for 2 more years.

Roofguy Said: Who among us is not forced to tap their foot or rock their leg when Kodachrome comes on!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pLsDxvAErTU

Or Rocketman.

I stray from Country to Rock, to Hard Rock. I nearly always come back to Rock that is toward the hard side but not completely there. My favorites these days: * Five Finger Death Punch * Hellyeah * Skillet

There's a lot in that, but I think the work that bdub and Pattern X are doing...that's their song. The work Copperman does, the work Old School does, that's their song. So even if there is economic or utilitarian value connected to something, it is not the economic or utilitarian value that defines it as a song. Advertising jingles that utilize memorable bits of music have a lot of utilitarian and economic value but nothing that carries us into a higher realm. I'd like to think that it is the pure, honest expression of our existence that has the power to move us to tears. Knowing full well that one day we will be gone, we stand up and sing our song anyway. Marking the place where once we stood in the living world, regardless of any economic or utilitarian considerations. But the man or woman who provides a livelihood for multiple families, building something that supports other people's songs...that can be a song too when you look back on it if it was a valiant effort and done for righteousness. Just my guess, really.

Tim, you trying to drag me down memory lane?

Simon and G: "Hear my words that I might teach you,Take my arms that I might reach you. But my words like silent raindrops fell, And echoed In the wells of silence..."

Dylan: "...He said, "I never engaged in this kind of thing before But yes I think it can be very easily done" We'll just put some bleachers out in the sun And have it on Highway 61"

I could not get enough of those guys back then. Simon and Dylan are now pretty universally regarded as genius alright, but then there is Merle Haggard and etc. One of my absolute favorite songs back in the heavy roofing/drinking days was Hank Williams Jr. singing Superman Blues. Ian and Sylvia. George Jones. The Shirelles singing "Soldier Boy," There was so much great music all across the social map it was mind-blowing. When Rock and Roll got rude, even invading Country and Western, I pretty much tuned out.

Conjuring up all these things just about brings tears to my eyes. Limbaugh, if he were to live for a thousand years could never come close to achieving that. Just not enough heart in him. Whenever I hear that voice of his blathering away as you put it, I have to get out of earshot.

There is a profusion of titillating ideas, fragments of ideas, personal experiences, vague hunches, and mental images that come to mind while perusing this thread and they all show some promise of somehow bearing on the subject(s) at hand, but I am looking at a busy day in front of me and so for the moment, as regards "sheeple" I only have the wherewithal to offer this: Most of us who take the time to participate in this "roofer" forum have a lot more going on in our hearts and minds than simply measuring, cutting, and fastening things while hopefully making money doing it. We have a diversity of interests, "other" interests, and those interests always pose the potential threat of dissipating our concentration on grabbing the Prize, however that may be defined and by whomever is doing the defining. The bottom line is it's a lot easier to draw a Royal Flush if you can just ignore those three other annoying suits and eliminate complexity in the deck. Sheeple take great comfort in that process.

bdub - The simpleton I am, I'm going to need to re-read your reply a few times......I think I like it. Some might call you a narcissist.....

I have a like episode at my sons' middle school graduation ceremony. There was a line 1/4 mile long, (I'm not kidding), of parents, siblings, grandparents, outside the amphitheater gates, all awaiting that specific 5PM gate opening.

Not accustomed to the "big city life" & it's inherent protocols, my wife, son & daughter simply strolled past all the "sheeple", up to the gate, where my wife asks the gate keeper; "Is this a line to get in?" We stood around a few minutes until the gate was opened whereby we simply walked in among the first few, ed our premium seats right up front and had a wonderful time.

I suppose it was the social engineering I've been exposed to as a youth I was battling, but I couldn't help feeling uncomfortable, (selfish?), about walking past all those people. My wife has undergone several back surgeries over the past three years & is in constant pain - There was no way she could've stood in that line - So I suppose I was justifying our actions.

On the other hand, I couldn't help commenting/confirming the prime example of herd mentality on display.

Do we think we're somehow smarter or more deserving than the herd? Maybe we're the the miss-informed ones. What if everybody "herded around" the gates, instead of having the self-discipline of waiting in a self-organized line?

I wish people would drive that way, (have some self-discipline in heavy traffic), - We'd all get to where we're going much quicker.

Hey, I get it - I agree - I'm absolutely against big gov't. I would rather the gov't go away. But one has to be realistic; It's not going to go away.

I know this will get a lot stirred-up - I think we might be better of without police - Keep some gov't & laws, but do away with the police officer. Give every citizen a badge! Image how polite everyone would become. That crazed/road raged maniac that ran you & your family off the road - If he jumps out and attacks you/family - No need to run - Dispatch him - carry-on - one less idiot to house/feed at the Grey Bar Inn.

What I have a problem with is those that capitalize, (no pun intended), on the fact there are laws - using them to perpetuate there so-called "freedom fighter" image, when in fact, if the laws were dismantled, they would perish.

To expand a bit; Sheeple or not, most fair-minded individuals will for the most part, operate their lives/businesses within the parameters of laws, if not for the simple reason to avoid conflict with their very existence/freedom. This is easy picken's for those unscrupulous types - Which, the construction/roofing industry is chock full of, especially in states w/o licensing, where anyone with a pulse can simply hang a shingle out.

TomB Said: clvr & CRFG; No offense guys, but I dont believe the licensing you have in Ill. is worth the expense your govt squanders on it.

No offense taken, I agree. Only thing different is that I think I'd rather NOT have a licensing system if it would save me and the consumer money. I can't say for sure, because I've not worked in a non-licensed state except for when I get calls from MO to fix horrible work over there.

I think that freedom is a word that is up for interpretation. Roofguy says that Texas is the only free state, whereas bdub seems to say none of US are free. I live up a 100 yard steep driveway leading to my 38 acres of freedom. I hunt deer in my "backyard" shortly past the sweet watermelon patch and the wild berries. I've pissed on every square foot and light fires bigger than my home.

The only problem I have is unlicensed guys doing commercial work whereas I play ball and pay a 42% work comp rate. I don't complain much though, I'm too busy. I decided to do a home show this year, and talked with a local contractor who was complaining for me about work comp rates and roofing licensure. He acted like he left roofing up to me, to get in my good graces(I suppose?) but I knew otherwise. I walk over to his booth, open up his pamphlet, and half of it is dedicated to roofing.

bdub; I like it. I agree, (I think), we all just simply need to make our way, as we feel fit, in this mess of a society &/or environment we've decided to live & work in. Also staying cognitive/coherent enough. As my Dad told me once "If you swim in poop, some's bound to rub off on you".

Some might construe that as head-in-the-sand, submission, antithesis - whatever. The sheeple are the gov't, as the gov't is the sheeple; The sheeple are herded/controlled via many dynamics. There is a predominant "herd mentality" among most any collective group, be it geographical, religious, economic, political, etc.....

I, myself am not a fan of big gov't - Quite the opposite. Trying to stay on-topic; Could it be, in some cases, the self-proclaimed freedom fighters, have in actuality, been duped - Only to be playing right into the hands of those powers at be? Ever wonder why these wealthy/ivory tower types are proponents of the democrat/left agenda? That's for another topic however, and I must get back to my own little happy place in the world, lest I will need a handi-wipe or a complete shower.

egg Said: Its important to try to keep your wife happy and its important to keep your energy positive. Cant deny that. Wouldnt deny that. Hate to have you disappear because I enjoy your posts. Maybe this is part of the weeds that make you stronger you were mentioning. Biting the top off a beer doesnt, even though it usually feels like it does. In the end, it always returns the favor.

Every environment has its downside. Every opinion has its blind side. We need a clear view of our opposites the way a catamaran needs outriggers. I havent owned a television in thirty years, but I keep my finger on the pulses around me. It was a hard lesson, but by staying true to my heart I carved out an existence I can believe in and take comfort in. It was an even harder lesson, but I discovered that even at the pinnacle of my own brilliance there is a lot of dumb in there. Humble exuberance is the only way to go. That and hard work. Think like a king, work like a slave. Be willing to do the best that you can and able to let the world take care of the rest by itself, even if its wrong.

AWESOME !!!!! B) :) :) B) Deep Down In Florida Where The Sun Shines Damn Near Every DAy

It's important to try to keep your wife happy and it's important to keep your energy positive. Can't deny that. Wouldn't deny that. Hate to have you disappear because I enjoy your posts. Maybe this is part of the weeds that make you stronger you were mentioning. Biting the top off a beer doesn't, even though it usually feels like it does. In the end, it always returns the favor.

Every environment has its downside. Every opinion has its blind side. We need a clear view of our opposites the way a catamaran needs outriggers. I haven't owned a television in thirty years, but I keep my finger on the pulses around me. It was a hard lesson, but by staying true to my heart I carved out an existence I can believe in and take comfort in. It was an even harder lesson, but I discovered that even at the pinnacle of my own brilliance there is a lot of dumb in there. Humble exuberance is the only way to go. That and hard work. Think like a king, work like a slave. Be willing to do the best that you can and able to let the world take care of the rest by itself, even if it's wrong.

I can't speak for Texas - But, I do know that consumers pay considerably less for same products/roofs in CA. as compared to Colorado.

Another interesting fact, is that piece-work rates are much lower in CA. as compared to Colo., yet hourly wages in CA. are much higher than Colo.

Another interesting phenomenon, is that roofers, in general, are much more proficient from CA. as compared to Colo. In the mid-90's we had to bring most of our roofers from CA., as the Colo. roofers demanded insane piece-rates, and were lethargic to boot!.....CA. boys came out and worked for far less pc-wk prices, ran circles around em' made waaayy more $! Go figure!

Not sure what or if licensing has anything to do with it - But, could be that since CA. demands such stringent standards, that the overall effect is proficiency, rather than glutinous behaviors, such as what hail storm & the absence of licensing affords.....just a thought..... ;)

I have been a licensed contractor in CA. since 1983 & a contractor in Colorado since 1992. It is my first-hand experience that the general quality of work in CA. fare exceeds the quality in Colorado.

Yes, CA. is generally a PIA due to bldg. code enforcement and licensing, as compared to Colorado where there is minimal bldg. code enforcement and no licensing for GC's or roofers.

The pay-off, is for the consumer & the legitimate business professional. The consumer, in that there is some solace knowing that licensed contractors all must maintain at least minimal credit worthiness & trade/business knowledge to even be in business. The legitimate business for competing with generally like-qualified competitors.

Possibly things have changed - However, I'm not privy to any earth-shattering developments as to state licensing activity in the last two decades.....

Having said that; Florida, along with most of the far-west states, (Wash, Ore. Ca., NV, AZ, NM, UT, ID), are the only states with any sort of effective state licensing. Everything else is pretty-much free-rein.

I can tell you with absolute confidence that, GENERALLY, there is huge quality of work, as well as public perspective aspects in a license state vs non-licensed.

Deep Down In Florida Where The Sun Shines Damn Near Every Day a licensed State, code is enforced. I've been in the roofing business here for 30+ years. I can tell you licensing has been good for Florida. After hurricane Andrew 1991 enforcement became fierce.It has been good overall for the State with standards high and communities greatly improved.

Deep Down In Florida Where The Sun Shines Damn Near Every Day B) :) :) B)

clvr & CRFG; No offense guys, but I don't believe the licensing you have in Ill. is worth the expense your gov't squanders on it. Licensing needs to be structured so it actually works. It sounds as if there is plenty of unlicensed activity going on, so as to raise doubt as to it's effectiveness.

I do business in two completely different states, with two completely different set of dynamics. One has effective licensing, one has zero state licensing, however has a complicated/idiotic maze of municipality licensing that is a total waste of time & money. So I can empathize with those that have not experienced authentic licensing so-to-speak.

Roofguy; 1. It has been my experience that the "old line roofers" fight venomously against state licensing, as it would break-open their rice bowl. 2. Some roofers would much rather win jobs based on their merit & actual ability/knowledge/experience, rather than a good ole' boy/salesmanship basis.