This is Roofing School! - PODCAST TRANSCRIPT

Editor's note: The following is the transcript of a live interview with Greg Bloom and Alison LaValley of Beacon and Dhaval Gajjar of Clemson University. You can read the interview below, listen to the podcast or watch the recording.

Intro: Hello and welcome to this month's RLW, Read, Listen, Watch, from Roofers Coffee Shop. My name is Heidi Ellsworth and we have a very special RLW this month where we are talking about roofing school. Yes, we have higher ed roofing courses that we're going to talk about today. It is amazing. It is because of a lot of work by some amazing people. We have asked our friends from Beacon and the Roofing Alliance and Clemson to come and talk about the new Clemson University Roofing Alliance certified roofing courses.

Before I get started, let's do a little housekeeping. This is being recorded and will be available within 24 hours. Please, share it out with all of your friends and family and especially your roofing professionals in your business and within the industry. Also, the chat is open. As you all know, we like to talk. Please, I already see it coming in here from Joe and Tammy, please let us know who you are and where you're from. And, please, share your comments, thoughts and especially your questions throughout this whole RLW. Let's get started. I am so thankful to Beacon for being the sponsor of this RLW and for Greg Bloom who is here today as one of our panelists who gives-

Greg Bloom: Hello.

Heidi J Ellsworth: ... so much to the industry. Greg, thank you for being here today.

Greg Bloom: My pleasure. Thanks for having me.

Heidi J Ellsworth: I love it. If you could introduce yourself for those few people who don't know you and tell us a little bit about what you do with Beacon, that would be awesome.

Greg Bloom: Sure, sure. I think I have the tenure award, although Alison's very close to me. I've been in the roofing industry for 42 years, since 1982. I am 42 years actually with one company. I was 36 years with Allied Building Products, and then Beacon gave us a blessing of acquiring us. I've been with Beacon for six years and I currently run the national account team for Beacon. They are a wonderful group of people that I'm very proud of every day.

Heidi J Ellsworth: That's so great. Thank you again and thank you for Beacon for being such an advocate and sponsor of everything the Roofing Alliance does, but overall in the industry. Thank you, Greg.

Greg Bloom: You bet.

Heidi J Ellsworth: Speaking of the Roofing Alliance, it is my honor to introduce Alison LaValley, the executive director of the Roofing Alliance. Alison, welcome.

Alison LaValley: Good morning or good afternoon to everyone here. And, thank you, Heidi, for having us. I'm so lucky to share this sort of stage right now with Greg and Dhaval and yourself. As you mentioned, I'm right on the heels of Greg. I can't say it's been 40 years. But, I have been with... I've also been with NRCA, and only NRCA and Alliance, since the late eighties. It's 36 years already. In the last three, specifically, overseeing the Roofing Alliance.

To say that I am blessed to have had the opportunity to work with so many of you that might be listening and others that will later, and along with my distinguished panelists for so many years and to really serve this industry and NRCA and the Roofing Alliance, can't say enough. When you can get up every day and love the work that you do and look forward to the work that you do, that really says something about this industry and just how wonderful it is. I'm lucky to be a part of it.

Heidi J Ellsworth: Alison, you've given so much to the roofing industry. It's just amazing. Thank you. Now, as executive director of the Roofing Alliance, it's just so fun to watch. It is just amazing. I am very pleased to introduce Dr. Dhaval Gajjar. Dhaval, thank you so much for being here. Please, introduce yourself and tell us about what you do and Clemson.

Dhaval Gajjar: Yeah, thank you Heidi again for having me. Like Alison said, I'm very humbled and honored to be here and share this panel session with the best of the best, Greg and Alison and you Heidi and just excited to be here. Excited to talk about what we're going to talk about. Because, that's my passion. It is our roofing industry and bringing more exposure to our roofing industry. A little bit about myself, I got exposed to our beautiful industry back in 2010, 2011, through my graduate school at Arizona State University. I was focused on roofing related research at that time, working on roofing products and [inaudible 00:04:53]. And, worked in the industry after I graduated from my graduate school for an extended period of time, and came to Clemson back in 2018 as a professor. Currently, I am the associate department chair. Along with teaching roofing at Clemson and doing all the good things for industry, I'm also responsible for making sure that there's a roof above our department buildings head as well. It just expanded to multiple different facets of my role. Glad to be here and thank you again for having me.

Heidi J Ellsworth: It's so great. This is such a distinguished group. I am just so excited about what we're going to talk about. Everyone on here, I have to tell you, the chat is blowing up. I do want to say real quick, Tammy, thank you for giving us the update on the hurricane. For everybody, I see a lot of folks here from Florida, we are thinking about you. I hope everything's good and those floodwaters are receding quickly. The chat is open. Be sure to continue sharing who you are. I love Beth's comment, just to work for the fantastic Greg Bloom. There you go.

Greg Bloom: I paid her to say that. I pay her to say that.

Heidi J Ellsworth: Well, keep it coming. Keep it coming. Get that cash flowing. We are going to get started. First thing, there may be several people who are like, "What is the Roofing Alliance?" Alison, I would love it if you could tell everyone what is the Roofing Alliance, some of its history, what it really stands for.

Alison LaValley: Sure, I'd be glad to. The Roofing Alliance, I could talk about it in a number of ways. But, I will narrow it down to say that it is a dedicated group of 200 plus thought leaders. When I say thought leaders, we're talking about a culmination of industry professionals. Whether that be contractors, those in distribution like Greg, those on the manufacturing and supplying side, we have individuals, organizations, Roofers Coffee Shop, Roofing Contractor magazine. Again, everyone that supports the industry is involved in the Roofing Alliance and encouraged to be a part of it. We are truly member driven. We're small but mighty, right? Because, when you think about the size of our organization, we are a nonprofit. We're a foundation. So, we cast ourselves as the foundation for the industry. We're also, I would say, the charitable or philanthropic arm of the National Roofing Contractors Association. We work hand-in-hand and collaborate on a lot of projects.

But, when I say we're small but mighty, even in an organization with 200, these thought leaders... talk about a dedicated group. We have meetings. We have task forces. We have committees. A lot of virtual meetings too. We really get down to a lot of work. That work centers on four pillars. Those four pillars fall around education and training with a real emphasis on workforce development. Technology, sustainability and then, again, that philanthropic outreach, protecting communities. We're innovative in our approach. Always thinking big picture. I had the pleasure, and Greg didn't pay me even if he says he paid Beth. But, Greg is our mediate former chairman. He just rolled up and still serves as a mediate for it, but was our chair all of last year.

When I talked about the Alliance early on, when Greg came on board as chairing that, I talked about someone in an organization that really doesn't think out of the box. Greg pushed us to think as if there was no box. I mean, what are the possibilities about what this organization can do? With that approach, the steps we took, I mean we've been around formally as the Roofing Alliance since 1996. Started by, when you're talking about a pioneer, Melvin Kruger. He and a number of members and our former CEO, Bill Good, really got core group together to say, "Let's look at the possibilities to shape this industry in an innovative way and really secure its future." That's how I like to cast the lines.

This past year, a lot of the work that we did, really innovative in nature. Again, outside of the box. Greg pushed us. We hired a company really to look at us strategically and how we were positioned in the market, and what else we could be doing as far as giving back. It's about giving back as a foundation typically would. But, in doing more and really honing in on that educational workforce development piece. There's a lot going on, a lot of arms to that. I could go on and on, between the student competition and the faculty retreats and all the workforce initiatives. And, look at the curriculum. I mean, Dhaval and this liaison in partnership with Clemson, invaluable over the last five years, invaluable when you think about bringing roofing to higher education.

Again, I could go on and on. But, just the importance of having members and funding these initiatives that give back to this industry. It only makes our industry stronger. That, I think, is the key to making sure we're really vital in the work that we're doing, revolutionary, transforming what we're doing and really empowering that philanthropic outreach to continue to give back.

Heidi J Ellsworth: Greg, we are so honored to have become a member during your presidency or chairmanship. It really was a dream for me, something I've wanted to do for a very long time. How important, just being involved. You've been involved with the Roofing Alliance for so long through Allied and Beacon and everything. Can you talk about just how important it's for you and for the industry?

Greg Bloom: Sure. First of all, I want to say thank you again for joining. And then, I also want to point out that certainly Alison gave me plenty of kudos about the time that I was vice president and then also president's last chair. But, I couldn't have done anything without her and without the staff at the Alliance. I tip my hat to them every day. I love them all dearly. They really make things happen for the Alliance. I've been involved in the Alliance since 2009. Allied and Beacon have been... Allied was a founding member. And then, Beacon joined I think very shortly thereafter. Let's just say Beacon for the rest of this conversation. Beacon's been involved for well over 20 plus years in the Alliance, and I've been personally involved as a trustee since '09. It's been honestly and truly so rewarding for me. I have a lot of rewards that have been... and blessings that I've been given in this industry.

I will tell you, this is right at the top of the list. What we do every single day and the way we give back is second to none in this industry. I'm not trying to be hyperbolic here. But, being the old guy in the industry, I know a lot of the stuff that's going on. It's just fantastic. What we do and the amount of effort that those 200 plus members and all the people that work in those companies, what we do for the industry. One of the things that I challenged at the NRCA board when I first took over as the Alliance president was to say, "Hey, this is all about giving back." If you haven't started getting involved, and I'm not asking for money, but if you want to give me money and give the Alliance money, of course, but just get involved. Just be part of something special. That's what this is. It's truly something so special. We're making an impact on people's lives every single day.

Heidi J Ellsworth: It really is. One of the things that I think is so important is the Roofing Alliance has really opened up avenues for funding for new initiatives. I think back when we were first starting National Women In Roofing, we went to the Alliance and they granted us funds for two years. It really was what started, helped get National Women In Roofing started. But, Alison, every year you have a call for funding. But, you've also opened it up throughout the year. Let's talk just a little bit about that process of how people can get funding from the Alliance, and really then that will lead us into the next, Clemson.

Alison LaValley: Sure. We have a... It's sort of open enrollment. We tend to review everything after the first of the year. That's the deadline, the end of the calendar year in December. But, we have made exceptions because, when proposals or research or initiatives, programs are brought to us throughout the year, we do take a look at them and we take them to our board of trustees. We have a stellar group on our board. This year we're led by Reed Gooding, a contractor this year. We do alternate between contractor and supplier side for leadership. Those proposals, we really take a look at them.

The example was SkillsUSA. This year, SkillsUSA came up about us getting involved in being a sponsor for that and really being there. And, it fit perfectly, worth our workforce development initiatives. We looked at that in the middle of the year. And then, at other times, you mentioned we've helped fund National Women In Roofing, among other things. Again, one of the biggest things that we helped fund over five years ago was the start of this roofing curriculum at Clemson. Dhaval will get into that more. But, he came to us with this idea. That was a discussion too, with even members. We had one of our members, Dennis Conway, who's been just so visionary about our construction management initiatives. Said, "We've got to start somewhere."

That started the student competition. And then, it was reaching out to faculty. It's always been about the Melvin Kruger scholarships. And then, here was this piece with the curriculum where Dhaval came and he had made relationships. He had been in the industry. He understood and he had passion for it. And then, came to a meeting and made a presentation. I know some of our members were excited right away, and others were like, "Oh, really? You really think?" [inaudible 00:15:20] But, it was new. How much interest would there be? You can be kind of skeptical. But then, we went all in. Because, Dhaval came and made a presentation and he'll share more, and talk about a presentation and to watch this grow. Because, it's one class, two, three, certificate program. I mean, I'm giving away as part of the presentation. But, it's just been... In five years, the growth has been phenomenal.

Heidi J Ellsworth: It is so true. Dhaval, let's talk about it. Let's talk about the history.

Alison LaValley: I opened it up for you Dhaval. I set you up. Come on.

Heidi J Ellsworth: Yes.

Dhaval Gajjar: Oh boy. Alison, thank you for just how passionate Alison is. That's how passionate I am. I know everyone on this call, on this webinar is. Because, a little bit of background, and like Alison said, there was a call for funding from the Roofing Alliance. But, before I get to the Alliance funding, I really want to give you a story about my personal story and how this all came about. I shared a little bit of that. I got introduced to roofing back in 2010, 2011. Just like anyone else, my professor at that time had a roofing project, a research project. He didn't know who was supposed to do it, and I needed a project for my graduate school. He said, "This is yours." And, I fell in love with it.

As soon as I started to learn more about the industry, started interacting with people in the industry and went out and inspected roofs as part of my graduate studies, I'm like, "This is a phenomenal industry," that is a well-kept secret, unintentionally. I mean, [inaudible 00:16:57], but it's a well-kept secret. And then, of course, I graduated, worked in the industry, managed large portfolios of building construction projects. But, roofing was always at my heart. And, I love teaching. I love to give back. So, after about seven to 10 years in the industry, I decided to come back and do what I love to do, which is to teach. That's how I ended up at Clemson.

The interesting thing happened when I came to Clemson. When I looked at our construction management curriculum, and this applies to really all over nationally within any construction management program, we had classes on pretty much everything. We look at concrete, we look at steel, we look at HVAC, we look at electrical, we look at estimating, general contracting world. But, guess what was missing? Our industry. I realized our industry was only taught for about 45 minutes in the entire construction management curriculum.

That includes undergraduate and graduate studies. I thought, "What are we doing here?" We have this beautiful industry that has amazing opportunities, amazing career path, a lot of good money and good people and you get to make a difference in someone's lives by giving shelter to them. I mean, what a beautiful story. That story doesn't exist. In 2019, about one year being at Clemson, my department chair met with the [inaudible 00:18:22] NRCA, Bill Good, through other relationships. At that time, my department chair introduced me to the Roofing Alliance, to Bill Good. And, the conversation was, "We have funding available for higher education and for any resource that you want to do within roofing." That's how the funding came about.

It's like there's a need for the industry. There's this gap in academia. And, there's a hunger for workforce. Why don't we bring all those three aspects together and create this beautiful proposal that hopefully the roofing industry will like it. So, I showed up in Phoenix in 2019 at the alliance meeting, not knowing anyone. I'm standing in front of 100, 150, one of the most highly achieved, highly qualified folks-

Greg Bloom: Vultures. Vultures.

Dhaval Gajjar: ... and talk about this roofing class. Very close. But, literally, liked my... My experience has been with the industry. As soon as I pitched this idea, they were excited. The industry professionals were so excited that they're like, "This is what we need to do." But, they were very skeptical because I had proposed creating a roofing class. There'll be three credits and that's going to count towards their construction management degree. And, we're going to do this in less than one year.

They're like, "You sure about that?" I'm like, "I'm not sure, but we're going to try." But, yes, we're going to do it. That's how this whole beautiful process started. It had just been amazing to see, in 2019, standing up and presenting this proposal. I want to give kudos to the industry, to the Alliance members. They were 150 at that time, I believe. They took a chance on this. This is not only a Dhaval show. This is actually a true collaboration between myself, Clemson, and hundreds of alliance members. Of course, there were a few key ones that were decision makers. But, this is a true academic industry collaboration, and that's why this has been so successful.

Heidi J Ellsworth: I remember being so excited listening to you present. But, I really had no idea how big this was going to grow. Greg-

Greg Bloom: None of us did.

Heidi J Ellsworth: Yeah. What were your thoughts when we first had this proposal?

Greg Bloom: Obviously, I wasn't one of the skeptics, I promise you, Dhaval. But, obviously, it was something that we were going to have to watch and see how it evolves. I was honored to be invited by Dhaval to speak at Clemson and be a guest lecturer along with Erik Zadrozny of Beacon. The interaction that class had with us that day was unbelievable. It really clicked then. And, I said, "We got something going here." And, obviously, Dhaval has something going here. I got to tell you, we were supposed to speak for an hour and a half. I think we were there for almost three hours. Right, Dhaval?

Dhaval Gajjar: Oh, yeah. Very [inaudible 00:21:22]

Greg Bloom: Because, I hate to talk. I hate to talk. But, no, it was the engagement. There were graduate students, there were undergrad students. They were phenomenal. I think I had 13 of them hit me up on LinkedIn afterwards to connect. It was great. I mean, obviously, I knew things were progressing nicely. But, that really... That's when I really felt like, "Okay, what I've done so far isn't near enough. I'm going to get more and more involved and do whatever I can to help."

Heidi J Ellsworth: That really was how it was built, was the industry experts. Dhaval, how did that... I mean, I was lucky. Karen and I also were lucky to speak. I mean, you just reached out and got so many people. Tell us, how did you put all this together?

Dhaval Gajjar: Yeah. That, again, goes back to 2019. One of the hardest things to do within academia is to put a new course together. It takes years and years to actually put a three credit course that will count towards your degree, at all levels. One of the challenge was, yes, we have this great idea, we want to do this, but what are we going to cover in this course? I am humbled enough to know that I don't know everything about roofing. I know 1% of a 100% that exists in the industry. So, I thought, "We need to go to the experts." We really need to go and talk to the roofing industry and really understand their perspective and their need from the industry. I mean, if we are serving a client, we want to know what the client wants. What's the need?

So, there was one simple question we asked via surveys to the entire roofing industry at that time, is, if you were to have a construction management student graduate and work in the roofing industry, what are some of the skills and topics you think are important for them to know where you won't have to spend as much time training and onboarding that they can go on first day and they can take on projects? We actually did a very robust study of the entire industry. Believe it or not, we got over 200 responses at that time, which was phenomenal. But, I'm going to keep going back to how phenomenal the people are in our industry. Through that collaboration, when we ran the numbers, we came up with about 27 topics that the industry thought was important that we needed to cover.

Of course, there's no way we can cover those 27 topics in four months of even one semester. So, what we decided was, as a pilot study, let's introduce a first course and take the top 10 topics that they deemed were absolute essential. That's what we did. As part of that, we really asked the industry to help us. As part of that study, we also asked industry experts to donate materials, to come and speak in my classes, to donate the content, to donate pictures. Heidi, I have to tell you, the amount of excitement, the amount of responsiveness I got from the industry was mindblowing. I mean, it got to a point where I was overwhelmed with what to do with all this information I have. That really solidified that the industry is excited about this. When I say this, it's a true effort between collaboration between academia and the industry.

When we offered the first course, we thought, it says roofing in the title at a college level, who's going to sign up for a roofing course? I mean, we didn't know. We were happy with four to five students at that time. It's a first course. If we get four to five students, we know we're successful. We had 23 students sign up for that first course. We were amazed by it. Now, to give some perspective, our traditional class for a construction management required classes, between 25 to 35. To have a 23 to 25 student course as an elective, that's phenomenal. That's very phenomenal. We actually did surveys as well before the class and after the class. That first class was so successful that it became the highest rated class in our department, period.

A lot of comments were coming like, "This is one of the best courses. We finally get to learn about the industry that we didn't know about. It's such a great industry." And then, came to a conclusion that they never knew what exists in our industry. They never knew. They were never told. That's how it was built. To go to the next 17 topics that were left, because the first course was so successful, another round of funding came about after that. We collaborated and came together and we said, "Look, guys, we're onto something here. Let's not stop the momentum." This was during Covid as well. We didn't know what was going to happen, but kudos again to the industry that they saw the vision.

The members saw the vision, the board saw the vision, the Alliance saw the vision. They said, "Yes, there is something here." So, we created two more courses in roofing. But, taking the remaining topics. That's what built this whole coursework, which is now we have three courses, three credits each, total of nine credits. We have a roofing certificate program. We teach them about... We'll go into the topics in the next couple of minutes. But, three courses, nine credits. The beautiful thing is those nine credits comes towards their graduation for their bachelor's degree, master's degree and a doctorate degree in construction as well.

Heidi J Ellsworth: Wow. Yeah. Cool. Alison, when you look at that and you think the funding that went along with that, I mean the Roofing Alliance has just been... It's almost a no-brainer. But, I mean, I know it's always stressful to apply and to come back and present. Dhaval, I'm not making it small, but everybody was so excited. Can you talk about that?

Alison LaValley: Yeah, it's funny. Dhaval shared with me some numbers even coming forward when he started talking about it. I know it sounds silly, but the hair on my arm is standing up. Because, I'm just so excited to see this evolution. Every year, he comes back. And, if he didn't come back, they'd probably ask where he was. But, these classes... One thing that even Dhaval mentioned about undergraduate, graduate, doctorate and then this is in person and online too. These classes, this attendance for all of these, sometimes these classes are in person.

During part of Covid, people were doing things virtually. The speakers were doing... Our members were talking virtually. For instance, Dhaval just shared with me earlier about the next class coming up. I'll let him share numbers when he talks about it. But, it's fully online. The amount of undergrad and grad students signed up for that is basically maxed out, already.

Greg Bloom: That's awesome.

Alison LaValley: Right. And, this is a repeat. So, this isn't new. We don't have to try... They hear from others and want more. I'm so glad we built on the first one to second and third because, now, which we'll talk about later too, we've mirrored that for the industry. Because, we have a online certificate program. Now, we're not only educating students, but we're allowing members to get their employees involved and new hires and sales teams, et cetera. Our work isn't over. As we are doing other work, and Dhaval will talk about it, we will have class four. Because, we are in the midst of funding a sustainability project and resiliency project, research project. That will turn into class four. There's just more and more. And, when you're talking about sustainability and resiliency, that piques the interest of so many of the younger generation, really the whole industry.

The tentacles of it just continue to grow and people are responding and it's positive. I know Dhaval could talk for hours about the surveys he does to the kids afterwards, where he mentioned it's one of the highest rated. I know hearing from industries, one of the top things of these classes, which is just phenomenal. But, the content and so forth, it's getting rave reviews. And, even though it's a partnership with Clemson, it's available to any construction management accredited university throughout the country and at the technical college level too. Because, we have technical colleges currently using the first class now. So, it's not just about the lines in Clemson, it's about all construction management efforts. Share that, we know that at least 10 to 12 other schools at least that we know about are using it. Arizona State's built up a program. Kirkwood Community College. In Florida, they're using it. At Bradley, they're using it. At Drexel, they use it. It's just phenomenal.

Greg Bloom: [inaudible 00:30:19] catching-

Alison LaValley: You got to cut me off.

Greg Bloom: The fire is catching on.

Heidi J Ellsworth: I know. The fire is catching on. I was going to say Cal Poly, Arizona. I mean, there's just so much. What do these courses look like now after... where we're at, Dhaval, so people get an idea of one, two and three, what they include?

Dhaval Gajjar: Yeah. Heidi, that's a great question. We wanted to be very strategic on how we layer some of these topics. Because, as part of our academics, we do a lot of research on how different generations learn. So, we actually put a lot of time investing in some of the different learning methodologies and what the research has to say and how and to what extent. We put a lot of thinking on how the whole curriculum was structured together. If you look at the first course, which is called our Roofing Fundamentals and just the name sounds, it's the Roofing Fundamental course. That first course really goes into, if you look at our first module, the question starts with, where is a roof on a building? I mean, that's where we start. We start with the basics from what's a steep slope and what's a low slope?

You're like, "Well..." So, we start with the very basics. The first course really builds knowledge for someone that does not know what our industry is. They can come and take the first course and walk out from their course knowing what are the different types of roofing systems, how are they installed, what are the different layers and components, how to do some basic estimating, safety aspects in the roofing industry. We talked about repairing and maintaining the roof, and we talked about career paths. Really, what that gives is a good foundation for someone that is not knowledgeable about the industry. This first course has been the most successful, like Alison talked about, as we go into other universities and colleges. Because, that's the one where the students get the knowledge of what the roofing industry is.

Now, I'm not spending too much time. We look at this, we spent four months on this content during a given semester. There's a lot of information. When we talk about, say for example, TPO, we spend one week on TPO. We're not just talking about five minutes on TPO. I mean, they have to know inside out on what that roofing system is, how it's put together, what are the building codes, what are the assemblies, everything. We go in depth of all these basic aspects of the roofing industry.

The second one is called roofing management, and that focuses a little bit more on some of the intricate details of the roofing industry. This is good for someone that has some basic knowledge, has taken the first one and he is going to go on the second one. There we focus on the building codes of the roofing industry. We talk about advanced technologies, we talked about risk management, we talk about hail, fire, wind, all those aspects. So, a little bit more in depth about what our industry is.

When we did the survey, it's very interesting that one of the key things that came about from the survey was the focus on business and leadership, which was very amazing to me. As we talked to the roofing industry, there was a heavy need for a leadership and business aspects of the roofing industry. Hence, course number three focuses on communication, sales and marketing, which you have come out and done at Clemson. Thank you for doing that. A leadership, negotiations, sales, starting a business, how to sustain a business, some financial aspects of business. That third one focuses on the business and leadership force. If you look at this curriculum, the industry is so excited because this is one of those curriculums that covers pretty much all the major things that you would want someone to know about our roofing industry.

The beautiful thing about this course is we recruited experts from all over the country. Like we have Greg and Heidi, you. You have spoken on a few of the topics. We recruited experts from the industry and vetted the content with the other Alliance members and the task force, and really put this in a way where every industry expert got to contribute to their specific content. Industry experts were a huge help as we put together this content. Again, we have a fourth one coming up on sustainability. That's going to be added as well. That's coming up next spring. Believe it or not, the next step is a roofing minor. That's what we're going to go after. We have a certificate now, and then we have a roofing minor. A student graduating from-

Greg Bloom: What is that?

Dhaval Gajjar: ... these programs will have bachelor's degree in construction management with a minor in roofing. What a beautiful thing. What a beautiful thing.

Greg Bloom: You ever think we could get there?

Heidi J Ellsworth: It's just so cool.

Dhaval Gajjar: [inaudible 00:35:01] in five years. All in five years, less than five years.

Heidi J Ellsworth: The fact that it's going all over the country and going to other schools and other schools are able to get this curriculum and the manual, which you have a full textbook now for the courses and that is free through the Roofing Alliance to any university construction management program, vocational school. We have a great question. This is a perfect time. Joe. Hello, Joe. Said today, "How can we offer time support for the education presenter sharing areas of experience and expertise? Is there a need for individuals?" I think there's a need for teachers, wouldn't you say?

Alison LaValley: Yeah.

Dhaval Gajjar: Yes, yes and yes.

Greg Bloom: No question. No question.

Dhaval Gajjar: Absolutely no question. What we have found out is one of the top-rated aspects of this whole curriculum was involving industry experts in the classroom. Anyone listening on this call, if you have a local college, a local technical college or a local school, they have any sort of construction engineering or any sort of engineering courses, reach out. Because, I'm the associate department chair, and we love and we always say yes. Because, we need industry to come into our classrooms. That's one of the greatest ways to get involved within your local institution and talk about roofing and your expertise. Maybe leave a side note that I have a curriculum that I know that you can implement for free if you're interested. There's a lot of different ways I can get involved within your local institution. Absolutely.

Alison LaValley: Another way to get involved, Heidi, if I can add too, is not only serving as a guest speaker. But, I'll use Arizona State University as a perfect case here. They were interested. We've partnered with them on other research. They were familiar with the Alliance. Definitely knew Dhaval. Had been at meetings and so forth. But, they just didn't have the faculty member like Dhaval. I can send you the link today to the class. It's got all the PowerPoints. It has all the tests. It has all the work, PowerPoints, outlines, whatever.

But, you have to have the right person that's able to teach it. ASU couldn't find somebody and so forth. So, there was someone, another way to get involved. The person that's actually spearheading that class effort there and continuing that teaching is someone from the roofing industry who had since retired and was interested in staying involved, was already partnering in new people. From the Arizona community, they reached out, talked to him and now he's the one shepherding that class at ASU, serving as the teacher. They also bring in guest lecturers too. But, his vast knowledge, he was in the industry and with a lot of our manufacturer members for a long time.

Greg Bloom: Long time.

Alison LaValley: [inaudible 00:37:55] So, he's there. He has contacts. He's brought stuff in. Now, that class there is also in demand. When we launched it at Cal Poly just this last spring, they modeled it more of what Clemson's doing. We had an instructor. They participated in our student competition before, familiarity with the industry, familiarity with the Alliance. Implemented it because we gave them everything to do. And then, they brought in guest speakers for every week and followed Clemson's lead. No matter how you want to work it, again, there are a lot of options here to get involved.

Heidi J Ellsworth: Everything. To that point, Tammy Hall is just saying, "This is great. Florida Gulf Coast University is offering three elective credits in roofing in their construction management force." They wanted to get your contact information of all. What I was going to say for Joe and for other folks out there, reaching out to Alison and the Roofing Alliance so that she can connect you to universities close to you, reaching out to Dhaval, we can share all that. I can make those connections, or if you all want to put in the chat, however we want to do that. But, this is the great stuff that really we need more teachers. Great thing. But, I want to make sure we don't run out of time to talk about the next step, which is really key. That was how do we bring all this great work that Dhaval and team and Clemson and Roofing Alliance had done, how do we bring it online to the industry overall? That is not as easy as you would think. Dhaval, how did you then go to create an online course where people, anybody, can get-

Dhaval Gajjar: Yes.

Heidi J Ellsworth: ... a certificate?

Dhaval Gajjar: Yes, Heidi. It looks like we're transitioning to this other part now, which is very exciting. Again, to me. Before you go there, just to note, the Florida Gulf Coast, I met with them last week and they're excited. I'm glad that there's connections happening already based on these chats. I'm so glad. They're actually going to take one of our first courses and offer it there. Very, very exciting. Just to transition, here's what was happening. As we were presenting, as we were putting together this curriculum, as we are offering these courses, the industry saw what we were doing for our students within construction management. Not just at Clemson, but all over the country now because we shared the curriculum. One of the common questions that kept coming up was, is there any way that we can put our professionals through the program?

Because, it's such a robust curriculum. It's well put together. It's done back by industry research and how folks learn research, academic research. This is one of the only types of curriculum that covers all these gamuts of different topics within our industry. How can we take our people and put through this? Because, there's a need not only for workforce attraction, but for workforce retention as well and to raise the knowledge of our people and raise the quality of our workforce. We didn't have the answer to that. Neither did the Alliance, nor did we. But, again, we never say no and we go figure it out. We went back and we said, "There has to be a way where someone from the industry can have access to all this beautiful curriculum without having to go through school." That's when the concept of online learning came about.

There is actually a means that we were able to figure out to take all the content that we have developed and tailor it to the industry professionals. What that meant was we had to take what was created here, do a lot of research on how the professionals learn and modify and develop some content and some tweak the content to be suitable for roofing industry professionals. That took us about a year and a half to complete that project. What we now have is similar to the roofing courses, which we talked about, roofing fundamentals, roofing management, roofing business and leadership. We have the similar courses that are tailored to industry professionals that they can take these three courses.

The beautiful thing about these courses is, guys, there's no quizzes, there's no semester project, there's no syllabus. What it is, is we have taken the bare content and given you all the content. These are all self-paced modules. If you take course number one, it's about eight hours total. It's all self-paced. Once you sign up, you can finish it at your own leisure. It includes beautiful videos, PowerPoints, images, graphics. It's a fun interactive course. If you finish the course number one, you can get a certificate now from the Alliance and Clemson, which is a joint certificate. Which by the way is very, very precious. Imagine having a paw and industry logo on one certificate by going through one course. [inaudible 00:42:49] That is very, very special.

Heidi J Ellsworth: Hasn't really happened anywhere else. This is really special.

Dhaval Gajjar: It hasn't happened. This is very rare, very special for an academic. And, to share the logo and to do collaborative efforts together. We have three courses. They're about eight hours long. The first course is self-paced. It's about eight hours of content. You take the final exam. You have to have 75% to pass the exam, and you get the certificate. It's similar for second and number three as well. If you take all three, you get a roofing professional certificate that is officially from the Clemson Paw and from the Roofing Alliance industry. That is actually signed by Greg Bloom since he was the president, and Alison and myself. Again, this is coming to... And, to give you numbers, we have had now over 250 professionals go through this program. We have had amazing reviews. I mean, we collect surveys and data and it's outstanding how much has this course been elevated among the industry. And, how well liked course this is. Not just because it's fun, but because of the content, what you learn from these courses.

Heidi J Ellsworth: Well, I have to tell you, I'm going to take it. I was supposed to start July 1st. But, I'm starting soon. I'm really excited to see it. I know that we have a lot of people out there who are taking it. Now, we did have one question come up from Brad. He wanted to know when the sustainability courses will be available. Next spring, question mark.

Dhaval Gajjar: It will be next spring, which is spring of 2025. And then, it'll be available for the industry professionals similar to the first three, somewhere around next year in the summer. We are developing that as we speak currently. Again, we don't create something just to create it. We take our time and we produce something that is quality. Right now, we're focusing on understanding what is our industry doing when it comes to sustainability and resiliency. We're collecting gazillion data points so we can come up with something that is relevant and that is quality. We can put something together just to say we have, but we don't do that.

Heidi J Ellsworth: No.

Dhaval Gajjar: It'll be available next summer.

Heidi J Ellsworth: So good.

Alison LaValley: Really good. This curriculum, if I can add, Heidi, when you're thinking about it for your employees or yourself, I mean, you're taking it, right? We've had a lot of... We've had some people take individual ones. We've had some people take all three. Bob Pringle on our board of trustees and some of his staff have taken all three. And then, there's an opportunity to share that certificate online on LinkedIn and so forth. But then, here you've got and kudos to Beacon Building Products and Greg and his team who have taken that.

Greg Bloom: No, Greg.

Alison LaValley: And, I'll let Greg talk about it. But, made a commitment to their company and their employees. What is it? New hires and sales, Greg? I mean-

Greg Bloom: Yeah, I'll let y'all... Yes, absolutely. Obviously, being intimately involved with the Alliance, but obviously also being intimately involved with Clemson, this was a no-brainer for Beacon. With Alison and Dhaval's help, we had meetings with Beacon's training team and myself of course and we came up with a requirement for all new hires to take this course, the first one, the Roofing Fundamentals course. If they want to take the other courses, they're more than welcome to do that. It is now a requirement within Beacon for a new employee to take it. But, we also offer it to anyone in the organization that's been with the company and wants to get a refresher. Or, maybe it's an admin person or in another role other than sales that wants to take the course. From what I can see, it's truly taken off. We have a lot of people taking the course right now. Obviously, we have several that have already completed it as well. Like I said, it was a no-brainer for us.

Alison LaValley: I know others... Thank you, Greg. Again, thank you to Beacon. There are others like Ivy Roof Systems, Eagle, John Campbell and his group. I mean, he challenged not only... He put a challenge out and a lot of his leadership team is required to take Roofing Fundamentals. And then, after that, they're encouraged to take the other two and they've got a deadline by December 31 to get that done. His email is signed off, "Put the pedal to the metal." I just read his email too.

Greg Bloom: Exactly.

Alison LaValley: And, get it done. A lot of our contractors, Baker Roofing's been a big supporter and just a lot of other people on our board of trustees have taken it and implemented it. Some for new hires some have tried it out and are now implementing it. I saw somebody in the chat, "How can we do it?" We can give you a link. The beauty of it too is, if you're an Alliance member, no there's a base price, one base price for anybody. If you're an NRCA member, there's a hundred dollar discount. If you're an Alliance member, it's 300 hours off. If you're going to do any kind of bulk, if you are going to do something where it's like what Beacon's doing or what some of our other members have done and want to buy it for multiple, Global Roofing, R.J. Radabenko, who is really involved in the NRCA and Alliance, just bought a hundred seats.

Greg Bloom: Geez.

Alison LaValley: I'm going to plot people in, but I want a hundred seats. And then, I'll figure out which class, which employee. And then, he'll personalize that journey for Global with Dhaval. That's the beauty too. If you want to do what Greg talked about and personalize it for your company, or you want to buy the block and get the discount and then figure out what to do, there are those possibilities. We're willing to work with you. I don't want anybody to think it's just set in stone and you have to do X to get your certificate. A lot of possibilities. Anybody can reach out to me, and then we can make the connections with Dhaval. Just a lot of possibilities out there. And, that sustainability class will be coming. I promise you that.

Greg Bloom: That'll be [inaudible 00:48:52].

Heidi J Ellsworth: [inaudible 00:48:53]

Alison LaValley: [inaudible 00:48:53] don't you worry. I'm just kidding.

Heidi J Ellsworth: We're going to share how to sign up here in just a minute. Hang on for that. Tammy, you and me, she's ready. She's going to take it. She's excited and thanking all of you and Dhaval, especially for all your hard work.

Dhaval Gajjar: [inaudible 00:49:09].

Heidi J Ellsworth: Susie. I'm really excited. We're going to get you where to do it.

Greg Bloom: Yeah, it's great.

Heidi J Ellsworth: I know. Okay. We talked about the why, what it is, why you should do it, how it's helping the industry. I want to make sure we talk a little bit about who should sign up. Alison you started down this road. But, maybe talk about that bigger picture of all the different people and how and who they should be signing up.

Alison LaValley: For the courses specifically?

Heidi J Ellsworth: Yeah. For the courses.

Alison LaValley: Yes. It's open to anybody. I'd say, "Hey, everybody. Do it tomorrow." But, again, take a look at it. You can see the outlines. You can go to... The best place just to start is the Roofing Alliance website and go to roofingalliance.net. We have a multitude of information. But, the classes are there. There's outlines that talk about what specifically is covered. If you decide to do it, it's all done automated to Clemson Online, which is a beautiful setup. But, if you are an Alliance member and need that $300 discount code, you will have to try to reach out to me or somebody on staff. Because, I can't publish that on the Roofing Alliance website. Our site is not locked down. Then everyone would be taking it. But, again, think about it too, about if that's something that you'd like to buy that block. Because, again, the more you buy, there's a larger discount again.

Or, you could try it and one of you can take it and then come back to us and say, "I'd like to do more." Especially for new hires, that roofing fundamentals class, it's great because soup to nuts about everything. But, don't forget about anybody else in middle management and leadership. That's what I was really pleased to see John push back. Because, I've had a couple of, I've talked to a couple people personally that have said, "I've been doing this for 20, 30 years. What else is there to learn?" Well, true. I'm sure someone in the industry that long knows a lot. But, there are other facets, there are other opportunities. Maybe then roofing fundamentals isn't for you. But, maybe roofing management or roofing business and leadership, hone in on some sales skills or marketing skills, negotiation skills, et cetera. Again, if you look at the outlines, what's covered, it's amazing what you can pick up on. Really, when you think about it, it's eight hours of your time. There's bound to be a nugget or two there that you can expand your horizons and pick up some more information. And then, the certificates-

Greg Bloom: I was going to say-

Alison LaValley: Go ahead, Greg. Sorry.

Greg Bloom: No, I was just going to say, especially if you focus in the industry on low slope roofing, but you want to learn about steep slope roofing or you want to learn about metal roofing, you want to learn about waterproofing. There's so many ways to expand on your knowledge.

Dhaval Gajjar: To both of your point, we have had manufacturers, distributors and contractors. If you actually look at who has taken the course, and it is all the different sectors in the industry. Really, this would be a great course for someone who is coming into our industry, doesn't know about our industry or someone who is a fresh start in the industry. We have had office admin, we have had internal sales and outside sales. We have had estimators take the course, project managers, at the superintendent lever, the field engineer. It's for really for anyone who just wants to expand the knowledge. If you have anyone that could benefit, because we have even had seasoned professionals, like Alison mentioned, take this course. And, they said, "I learned something that I didn't know before."

Alison LaValley: [inaudible 00:52:52].

Dhaval Gajjar: And, they took second and third. We hear that very commonly.

Greg Bloom: Absolutely.

Dhaval Gajjar: Again, this is for the industry. Use it. I assure you, it's going to be rewarding for anyone that takes it.

Heidi J Ellsworth: Well, I can just say, really, it all starts at the top of a company. As a leader, even though you maybe have 20, 30, 30 plus years of experience in the roofing industry, you're going to learn something and then you're going to be able to share that with the rest of your company. That is our plan at Roofers Coffee Shop, is I'm taking it and then I'll be able to talk with it to all these young, vibrant, amazing people who work at the coffee shop who maybe don't know as much about roofing who are going to be able to learn that. I think every company out there is that way, whether you're manufacturing, distribution, contracting, media, it really doesn't matter. We all want to have that same knowledge. Greg, some of the people who have started taking it, any feedback as of yet?

Greg Bloom: Oh yeah. I hired a gentleman from James Hardy to be in a director position for national accounts. He's in the process of taking it. Obviously, he was focused on selling composite siding or excuse me, fiber cement siding and all the accessories to go with it. But, now, he's learning all about roofing and all about waterproofing. Obviously, that's going very well. Yes, some of the other people that have taken it, completed it and passed are ecstatic about it. Thank you for asking.

Heidi J Ellsworth: You do have two chances to take the test in case you don't pass the first time.

Dhaval Gajjar: Correct.

Greg Bloom: Yes, you do.

Dhaval Gajjar: Correct. Just to make everyone aware, eight hours seems like a lot. But, you get 60 days to take it. That equates to about one hour per week. It could be a Friday, you could be flying, you could be at home, at nighttime. It's very adaptable to any technology. You do get two chances to pass. It does take some-
Alison LaValley: Like you said, Dhaval, you can start and stop those modules. I've had people tell me they've completed a thing on all their travels on the airplane. I was talking to someone else a couple of weeks ago, and she has a couple of sons who play baseball. And, goes... you know how long baseball season is, if you've got kids that are involved in that. She's on the stands, she's taking the modules while they're practicing.

Greg Bloom: In the bleachers.

Dhaval Gajjar: Yeah, we have made it very friendly for the industry professionals. Because, I'm from the industry. I know how much work we have. So, it's really customized to the industry professionals. Yeah, that's funny to know, Alison.

Heidi J Ellsworth: I love it. Here was one of the big questions. How do I get started? Alison, let's walk through it again. How do people get going on this?

Alison LaValley: My bad on this PowerPoint. I didn't catch. It's roofingalliance.net.

Heidi J Ellsworth: Oh my gosh, I'll fix that up.

Alison LaValley: That one, I didn't catch. Roofingalliance.net. Really, if you start there, like I said, you can see all of our information. But, there's links to the courses and it'll take you to Clemson Online. But, again, the discounts. If you're an NRCA member, it's a hundred off. If you're an Alliance member, it's $300 off. There also is bulk pricing. Again, if you're interested in larger things, you can reach out to me and even reach out to me for the code. Because, you can actually email us at roofingalliance@nrca.net or my personal email is alavalley@nrca.net.

Heidi J Ellsworth: I know that's probably not very professional for me to change that in the middle, but I want you to have the right address. So, roofingalliance.net and here it is.

Dhaval Gajjar: I just posted the link that [inaudible 00:56:36]

Alison LaValley: Yeah, Dhaval put it up. Thank you, Dhaval, for shortcutting my SVGS. Hey, in addition to that, reach out to me. If you have heard this and now want to get connected to somebody, one already connected and you want to start talking about this program, you want to teach. You want to teach at Clemson and help Dhaval, let us know that too. We're always for industry people. And then, I can also share with you schools that are already, like I said, up and running like Cal Poly and Arizona State and others. Lots of ways to get involved. And, just take the class too. Hey, if you need more information on the... Oh, Heidi put my email address up. Great. Just learn about the Alliance too if you're not already involved. I'm always available to talk. Like you said, everybody knows Greg. So, Greg will give you an earful about the Alliance too and all the work that we're doing.

Greg Bloom: I put my email in chat.

Alison LaValley: Yeah. One of the biggest things, even if you're not even directly involved with the Alliance, but when we talk about philanthropy, we give back. One of the biggest partnerships we have is with Ronald McDonald House. If you are interested in helping out, we have adopted all 160. I had to make that plug. We've adopted all 165 standalone roofs. Those are our members, and our same members have done that. We repair, maintain, replace, provide materials for all those roofs. So, there are opportunities to get involved with us in many shapes and forms. I'm always around, always available if you want to talk.

Heidi J Ellsworth: I have to tell you, having been involved for many, many years, there is nothing like the Roofing Alliance. If you're not a member, your company should talk to you. If you own the company, you should be thinking about it. You should be talking to your ownership about are we involved with Roofing Alliance. Obviously, you always want to be a member of NRCA. Because, that's where all this comes from. I really want to encourage... Okay, we will get the Roofing Alliance website dot net for Tim. I know you found the course description. But, not links on Roofing Alliance website. I think they're on the side, right? Alison?

Dhaval Gajjar: Yes, on the right-hand side.

Heidi J Ellsworth: You have to hit the course, Tim. Look at the course and then it'll take you down there. It'll take you to the classes, the actual and you'll see the links. But, as a company, sponsor your people. I guess that's what I was trying to say. Sorry I got sidetracked there. But, sponsor your folks, sponsor other people. It's well worth it a million times over.

Greg Bloom: Amen.

Heidi J Ellsworth: Any other questions out there, please get them into... Tim, if you have problems finding it, just let us know. You have the emails in there. Of course, it's heidi@rooferscoffeeshop.com. More than happy to help anybody get connected. Last words, Greg? Last thoughts?

Greg Bloom: Just for those of you that were getting educated today about what we do at the Alliance, I hope that we've touched your heart, we've touched your mind. And, if you want to get involved, reach out for us. Dhaval, I can't say enough about what you do for our industry. Alison, I can't say enough what you do for, not only our industry, but for me personally. Heidi, you are a dear friend and you've done nothing but contribute to our industry as well. Thank you all and I'm honored and blessed to be on this call.

Heidi J Ellsworth: Same back at you, Greg. You're so good. Alison, last thoughts.

Alison LaValley: Yeah, thank you for having us. I mean, you are... Member or not, you've always been one of our biggest supporters, Heidi. For those of you who took the time in the middle of the summer to listen to us talk and are interested, thank you. It just goes again to show the beauty of this industry. My love of this industry is beyond the words that I have, especially for everybody on this panel, Heidi, Greg and Dhaval. Near and dear to my heart, for sure. Like I said, I'm pretty much available 24/7. I don't sleep a lot. You want to... My mobile number's on everything with my email. So, you want to text me, call me, do it. I'm here to help. I'm that passionate about this. The more that we can get involved to get this work done and really elevate our industry, I'm all in. Thank you. Heidi.

Heidi J Ellsworth: That is so great. Dhaval?

Dhaval Gajjar: I know it's three o'clock, so I'll keep it short. But, I just want to say thank you, Greg, Alison and Heidi. I've enjoyed working with these amazing groups of people. I know there's three on the call I'm thanking. But, there's also others that have really pushed this. I'm really honored to be called part of this industry. I mean, I always joke about this that I work at Clemson University, but I feel like I'm part of the roofing industry every day [inaudible 01:01:16]

Greg Bloom: You are. You are.

Heidi J Ellsworth: You are.

Alison LaValley: [inaudible 01:01:17]

Dhaval Gajjar: Right? I work in the industry. I'm excited and I'm here as a resource for all of you. I put my email out there. If you have any questions about the curriculum or workforce or courses, feel free to reach out. Again, thank you again for joining this afternoon. I was really, really blessed and honored to be here with y'all.

Heidi J Ellsworth: Thank you, thank you. Thank you all so much for being here today.

Greg Bloom: Thank you.

Heidi J Ellsworth: It's been awesome.

Alison LaValley: Thank you, Heidi.

Dhaval Gajjar: Thank you.

Heidi J Ellsworth: I want to just... huge thank you to Beacon for sponsoring this and for really caring and giving back and spreading the news. Beacon, thank you so much. We will be back with our next RLW at the end of the month, so be sure to join us. Keep checking out those emails and keep signing up. Thank you and have an awesome day. We'll see you next time.

Outro: Cheers.