Coffee Conversations - Getting to Know REAL Roofing with National Women in Roofing! - PODCAST TRANSCRIPTION

Editor's note: The following is the transcript of an live interview with Ellen Thorp of Women in Roofing, Mandy McIntyre of Level Up Consultants, and Rae July of Steep Slope Opertions. You can read the interview below, listen to the podcast here, or watch the webinar.

Heidi Ellsworth:

Okay, good morning. My name is Heidi Ellsworth and this is Coffee Conversations from RoofersCoffeeShop. So excited to have you all here today. This is going to be an amazing Coffee Conversations. It is all about Real Roofing and a program from National Women in Roofing, part of their diversity, equity and inclusion program. I tell you what everyone, this is going to be amazing hour. So thank you so much for being here. I want to remind everyone that this is being recorded and it will be on demand within the next 24 hours. Also, this is interactive. We want you to chat, so say hello. So I would love to have everybody tell us where you're coming from this morning, ask your questions in the chat as we go. This is all about you answering questions and all of us having a great conversation. So let's get started.

Before we introduce our amazing panel of women, I would like to thank our sponsor, Certain Teed. Talk about an amazing company that has been on the forefront, has been involved with National Women in Roofing from the very beginning. They are committed to diversity and they just have a company culture that is incredibly inclusive. So thank you Certain Teed for not only being our sponsor today, but for being such a force within the industry and for helping lead the way into having a more inclusive roofing industry. Thank you so much. So starting out, first of all, I would like to introduce Ellen Thorp with National Women in Roofing. I had the pleasure of actually being the one to hire Ellen as the executive director, one of the best decisions ever. And I'm so happy to be here today. Ellen, welcome and can you introduce yourself?

Ellen Thorp:

Hi, I'm Ellen Thorp. I'm the executive director of National Women in Roofing. And I just think that I have the greatest job in the world that I get to build a career working with roofing associations.

Heidi Ellsworth:

I love it. And then I am just thrilled to introduce Mandy McIntyre. She has been on Coffee Conversations before. She's done such great things with mental health, diversity, everything, and she is leading the way on Real Roofing. So Mandy, welcome back. And why don't you tell everybody a little bit about yourself?

Mandy McIntyre:

Thank you so much, Heidi. And thank you for this platform for us to raise awareness about this new program that we're super excited about. I'm Mandy McIntyre. I'm based in Cleveland, Ohio. I'm the owner of Level Up Consultants, which is a company culture consulting company. And before that I was in the roofing industry for about 10 years. So I love the industry. I never want to leave and I want to make it the best industry it can possibly be, hence DEI.

Heidi Ellsworth:

There we go. I love it. And I am thrilled to welcome back Rae July, who's been on Coffee Conversations before. And Rae you as the lead of the DEI committee for National Women in Roofing. You've just been doing amazing things with Jess and the whole committee. Please introduce yourself and to everybody a little bit about.

Rae July:

Hi, good morning everyone. My name is Rae July [inaudible 00:03:41], and I'm the director of Steep Slope Operations at Chinook Building Envelope Services. We're in Fife, Washington. I also serve on the Board of National Women in Roofing as the co-chair of the DEI committee along with Mandy and Jess. I am just really excited to be here, be part of this program. I'm excited to share with you all what we've been doing. And I look forward to it launching on MLK Day.

Heidi Ellsworth:

Yeah, what a great launch day. So we're going to get into that. And I just want to say we keep saying Jess, but that's Jess Cress. And so a shout-out to Jess for everything she's done and just an amazing roofing professional. So Jess, here's to you. Okay, so I think what we really want to do is we want to start, even before we get into the Real Roofing, I'd like to take a minute and just talk about DEI because a lot of times, and I know there's people out there who are going to say, what is that? And what are you talking about? So Ray, let's start with you, just kind of talking a little bit... First of all, what is DEI, and why is it so important?

Rae July:

So DEI is diversity, equity and inclusion. And I think now more than ever, it's very important because we live in a world where not everyone is the same. Not everyone thinks and acts the same. And I think that it's important for us to be mindful and aware of DEI concepts, not just in the workplace but as we go through our daily lives. It has to do a lot with how you engage with each other. And it's just the basic fundamentals of being a decent human being and being mindful.

Heidi Ellsworth:

Yeah. And Ellen, yes, you're nodding. The DEI, this is something that's just been a key motivation for National Women in Roofing.

Ellen Thorp:

Yeah, the train is moving through the station. It's not 1985 anymore. We need to get with it. We need to do what is best for our employees to create a positive culture in the roofing association. I wish so much that it was sufficient or that it was enough for everybody just to be nice to each other or everybody just to respect each other. I wish that that was sufficient to creating an equitable society, but it's not. And after some really difficult things that our country went through a few years ago, there were lots and lots of companies that released statements and made a paragraph. And it was like every time you turned around, somebody else had a paragraph on LinkedIn about how they were going to do something better. And I'm just so proud to be part of an organization that is actually doing something. Like we made that statement and we're actually doing something. We have invested a significant amount of money in Real Roofing and we're v#ery supportive of our DEI committee that is pushing the envelope on some of these tough conversations.

Heidi Ellsworth:

It's been so important. And Mandy, as we kind of look at the DEI initiative out there, is important just overall. But it's also, there is such an important part of two in the roofing industry when we are looking at bringing talent and dealing with the labor shortages that are out there that unless... And you just have said so much around this, unless we are having more diversity and becoming more inclusive and making it equitable, that we're not going to be able to track the right people to the industry, right?

Mandy McIntyre:

Yeah, I've said for years now, there's no such thing as a labor shortage. We just need to elevate our game and we need to think about who are we marketing to as far as recruiting. And a lot of companies, it's an antiquated way of recruitment. And so we need to look at our individual businesses, at our company culture and see who are we appealing to, but who are we not appealing to? What is somebody's friction for not wanting to work at your business? And it very well may be that there is no diversity within your company, or maybe there is and you're not highlighting it. 72% of people on Indeed looking for jobs, are looking for businesses that have some sort of DEI statement policy, something. The incoming talent, these next generations, Gen Z Millennials, the most racially and ethnically, culturally diverse generations in history. So we need as an industry to reflect reality. And so that's why this program is so important to help your business attract that talent.

Heidi Ellsworth:

Yeah. Okay. Well, let's talk about that. Let's talk about this program. And so to kind of start out, what is Real Roofing? And Ellen, you were there at the very beginning. I was kind of there, but I wasn't involved. I was just watching this amazing thing. And I want to put out a huge shout-out to Jennifer Stone who just was a driving force there. And so Jenny, we're thinking about you. And so Ellen, why don't you kind of start at the beginning. How did this start? And maybe talk a little bit about the name.

Ellen Thorp:

Sure. I mentioned earlier that when our country went through a hard time when George Floyd was murdered and how several of us really felt like this was it, this was the call to action. Something had to be done. A man cried out for his mother. And so whether you're a mother or not, I think so many of us around the country were like, this... And it's unfortunate that it took so many of us so long to figure out that it was our responsibility to do something. And that's really where it started from. Jennifer and I really felt a strong personal responsibility that it was our job to try to make things better. And that we needed to educate other people. The teeniest tiniest step to start with was through education. And we are very fortunate that the executive committee of National Women in Roofing supported that.

We are very fortunate that we had very supportive sponsors. And so we really wanted to do this not just from, hey guys, let's sit down and talk about it and everybody talk about their feelings. We didn't want to do that. We really wanted to come at it from a research standpoint, from evidence-based best practices on how to educate people about DEI issues. And so we hired a consultant who's an expert in diversity education and association education. And she helped guide us to find research that would really create a very dynamic, engaging, intentional program. And so, one of the places that we look to for inspiration is the Center for Creative Leadership. And they have a proprietary framework for DEI education that they call the real framework. And it stands for reveal opportunities, elevate equity, activate diversity, and lead inclusively. And so we incorporated that into our pride and joy of the roofing industry. And that really is a lot of what the program is about, is marrying evidence-based best practices about DEI education with a custom element that relates to the roofing industry.

Heidi Ellsworth:

Wow. So Rae, you were involved from the very beginning also. I actually can remember where I was driving in the car when we were all on a call talking about this, and you've been really involved. So just from your perspective of the history of it and co-chairing the D E I committee, why was this so important to reach out and actually find a group that could help, like you said, through the data, through really research based to bring this kind of education to the industry?

Rae July:

So I'm going to tell you a story about our company. About five years ago, we became an employee-owned company. And this was probably one of the best things that could have happened to us because it meant that it was a great retention tool. Employees take pride in ownership. It was just fantastic. And so we had an evaluator come in, he had this beautiful PowerPoint presentation. We had this big employee breakfast and he presented. And right next to him presenting was someone translating everything he said verbatim in Spanish. The mark that we missed was 90% of our installers at the time only spoke Spanish. 70% of them only had about a fourth grade education. And so when they walked away from that presentation, they were confused, they were angry, and they kind of felt cheated because they didn't really understand what was happening. They felt like we were taking money from them.

There was all of these feelings because you have someone standing in front of them presenting to them all of this legal jargon and just things that doesn't understand. It's not something they do in their daily lives. And so we came back and we were like, why don't you understand this is great? But again, we missed the mark because we were not aware, it never occurred to us that someone in translating in Spanish verbatim something that is so technical to someone who only has a fourth grade education is not good. Now, if we had a program like Real Roofing at the time, it would've helped us understand that you have to meet people where they are. That having a big presentation the way we did it was not the best way to do this. And now in these recent years, what we've been doing is having these smaller groups.

We have no more than six of them, and we sit down with them every year and we hand out certificates. We have their certificates printed in Spanish so they can understand. We break it down, we explain to them. These guys are much happier now. They're more engaged in the program because they understand what it means to be part of an employee-owned program. And so, I'm telling that story because it connects directly to Real Roofing. And one of the reasons why we have this kind of program and we're excited to launch it because as a leader within an organization, you have to meet people where they are. You have to be able to communicate with them. You have to understand what equity means because not everyone starts from the same starting point. You have to be willing to have some compassion. It's not just with your employees and your coworkers, your customers, your manufacturers, your distributors, it's all encompassing. And I think this program, one of the reasons why we started it was to be more inclusive in this industry and to understand each other.

Heidi Ellsworth:

Yeah, wow. Mandy, you were also involved almost from the very beginning or what. It was the very beginning, right? Yes.

Mandy McIntyre:

Not quite the very beginning. I came in, I joined the committee, it had already started but I was somewhat in the beginning stages.

Heidi Ellsworth:

I love it. So where we're at today then on... Kind of maybe I'd love it... First of all, I want to remind everybody please ask questions, please chat. We want all that. But I want to kind of talk about the process because I think that's important how you all did the process, and all the interviews and everything like that, just to give this some substance. So Ellen, maybe you can start off and just share the process of developing this.

Ellen Thorp:

It was a really long process. Our intention, we wanted something that was custom for the roofing industry. There are some very good DEI education programs out there, and it would've been a lot easier to take one of those and just put our logo on it. But we really wanted to create custom content for the roofing industry. We also found that we had some really unique situations in roofing. So we convened an advisory group of people from several different roofing related associations, NWIR members, NRCA members, IBAC members and staff. And we really tried to drill down to what did our industry need and what were some unique things about it. And so in the beginning, I think many of us thought that it would be sort of education for the middle managers at a company so that they could relate better to their employees.

And that certainly is a need for the industry. But as we went through, we also identified other areas too. A lot of peer-to-peer interaction, installer to installer interaction. There were all sorts of different areas. We also found that it wasn't necessarily just about racial diversity or gender orientation or sexual identity. There were some themes that were woven throughout all of these things, whether you're talking about age discrimination or gender discrimination. And it's about educating yourself on how to look beyond the surface and how to look at your own behavior and your own actions as contributing to the challenges in the workplace. And how our own biases affect how we act. And that was really important. We felt like we didn't want this to be some sweet, fluffy thing that made people feel good about themselves. We don't want to make people feel bad about themselves either, but we really wanted to do the hard work.

And so we were really grateful to have support and engagement from people all over the industry. From the very beginning, we knew that we wanted it to be video based. We wanted it to be interactive. We wanted it to be quick and short. We wanted people to be able to sit in their truck at a job site and do it while they were waiting for the other people to show up or for some materials to get delivered. And we wanted people to do it when they were in line at the supply house or waiting for kids in school pickup. We also did not want it to require another username and passwords. That was at a time where a couple of us had just had it, and we were like no more usernames and passwords. So some of those things were very intellectual and some of them were very basic, like no more username and passwords.

Heidi Ellsworth:

I love it. Well, and a number of people were interviewed. And so Mandy, talk to maybe a little bit about that, about the people who were interviewed. Why did you pick those different folks? I will say, and I don't know if... I haven't watched the whole thing, I've watched the first one but I was interviewed. I'm not sure who all made the cut or didn't, but how did that work?

Mandy McIntyre:

So we wanted to make it industry specific. And also, I think we all felt that having real stories within the industry of how these topics apply to everyday life and everyday business, to really see the impact of that. So your stories are in there. I know Rae has some, I have some. And some of them, I'll say mine in particular was really challenging to actually talk about. I actually started crying during mine and I had never cried about this in my life until I had to talk about it, because I didn't really realize the impact that it had on me until I had to talk about it. But we need that, we need to see that these things happen. They're very impactful. But we can change the industry. We can change our company culture so that they don't happen again. So we don't have these same stories.

Heidi Ellsworth:

Right. And I really feel too, I have to tell you after I did my interview too I was shaky at the end because it's talking about things that you don't usually. That we grew up with don't talk about that, don't do any of that. But I think that having those real stories from people does make it people kind of start going, oh, well, how'd that work? And then I also know that you had a lot of people watch it and give feedback before the final. So Rae, you're kind of running on that. I had somebody from RoofersCoffeeShop who was in on that, who watched and gave feedback because I was like, I want someone else to do it. But Rae, how did that part of it work?

Rae July:

I think that's more along Mandy's line as this is [inaudible 00:23:03] program.

Heidi Ellsworth:

Sorry, so Mandy, how did that work?

Mandy McIntyre:

The feedback on the stories?

Heidi Ellsworth:

Yeah.

Mandy McIntyre:

I think we were all like wow. I think the biggest feedback was a lot of people didn't realize these lived experiences that people have had because they've never experienced it. So you only know your own lens of the world and how you see things. And if something has never directly affected you, it's something you probably wouldn't think about. So the feedback on the stories, a lot of them were, wow, that really happened or I didn't think about that. And so that's the whole point of the program is to get people to understand that just because you don't experience something firsthand doesn't mean it doesn't happen. And it's learning to acknowledge, learning to redirect the narrative so that everyone understands what really happens, can help change it and can help everyone feel included within your business and the industry.

Heidi Ellsworth:

And so I want to keep on that too because one of the things that I'd love for you Mandy to share is, as companies adopt this and they bring it in and they start watching it and sharing it with their employees and really working through the course, what are some of the main learning points of the program? And what can they walk away with?

Mandy McIntyre:

Sure. So some of the main components would be identity and language because words affect people. Language is important. And the old saying, sticks and stones may break my bones, but words can never hurt me. Not true. Words will stick with you for a lifetime, your bones will heal. Bias awareness, being conscious of our unconscious bias. We all have it, it's just being aware of it. Discrimination and prejudice are some big factors. And then leadership and culture because if you want to change the culture of your business and of the industry, we have to get leadership buy-in. And it's a top down, bottom up approach, it's all encompassing. And some of the biggest takeaways I think people will get from this program is just learning to appreciate the individuality of people, learning to respect people, learning to use different language that is more inclusive so that people feel a trust within their company. So that people feel a sense of belonging.

And that's what we all want, a great company culture. And then you can take that, there's your marketing for recruiting, there's your engagement for retainment. So it's really important to learn about all these topics.

Heidi Ellsworth:

Yeah. And how do you see... Okay, so now maybe I'm not going to be totally within the right thing, but I think this is really important for everyone to think about and talk about. So bottom line, besides doing the right thing, which should be the first thing. Let's talk a little bit about what does this do to help your business? What does this do that's going to help roofing companies, manufacturers, distributors, to have better businesses, to be more profitable, to grow their business?

Mandy McIntyre:

Yeah, so there is a McKinsey report that shows companies that embrace DEI initiatives are 33% more profitable. There's a Deloitte article, 20% increase and better decision-making. Diverse teams have a higher problem-solving rate. They have a higher innovation and creativity, but it's more than just the diversity, you need to keep everybody feeling included. So diversity is really what you see. It's like a numbers game. But to keep everybody feeling included, that's an action that you have to continue to work on. But there is so much reports on how more diverse companies are just more profitable, 33% more. So to get ahead of the game, just start doing this.

Heidi Ellsworth:

Well, and yeah, I think that's where Rae, you and your company you have seen and you've been working on this. Now you have Real Roofing that I'm pretty dang positive you're going to be incorporating in your business. So from a roofing contractor's perspective, why is this so important for your business?

Rae July:

We talked about company culture and we hear about this labor shortage all the time in the industry. When you have a company culture where people feel like they belong to something, they're welcomed, the leaders aren't just hearing them but they're also listening to them, it makes them want to stay. They invest their time, they invest their resources, it makes them stay. And not only do they stay, but they perform, they're productive. So when Mandy threw out the statistics earlier about being 33% more successful, that is because you have these individuals who now feel like they belong to something, like they're contributing to something. If your company culture is one that's full of toxicity, nobody's going to want to work for you. You're going to have high attrition constantly, that's what happens. And so for our company for example, when I became part of the DEI committee, it kind of gave me a little bit of, I guess courage to speak up more internally here as a leader in this organization.

And to say when I believe that things are not right, and highlight things and say, look, you can't say that. You need to be more respectful. And be mindful and be more aware of this large workforce we have who are predominantly Hispanic and how we can serve them. What things can we do better, because oftentimes we tailor things to fit ourselves. And we have to be more thoughtful of them and be intentional with those actions that we're doing. And so from a contractor's perspective, when you participate in this program, you are looking at now you have someone who is educated because a lot of the issues that we have when it comes to DEI, it's a lack of education. Let's call it what it is, somebody's just they don't know. And when I took the program, I learned a lot because there are things that I didn't know.

There were things like microaggressions and I grew up hearing these comments made to me throughout my personal life and my career. And I had no idea what they were until I understood what microaggressions were. And then I was like, oh my gosh, this is real. These tools that you're gaining it helps you be a better leader. It helps you be a better employee. And it just all around helps you to be a better person. And even though this is tailored for the roofing industry, you're going to find that it helps you outside of the roofing industry as you interact with others.

Heidi Ellsworth:

Yeah. And I do want to go back too and kind of hit on what was said earlier on this, is when we're looking at diversity for everyone out there, there is so much diversity. Age, gender, sexual preference, race, ethnicity, all of those kind of things that people need to think about. And I know within our company at RoofersCoffeeShop, we have a predominantly young employees, Gen Zs and millennials rule in this place. And it took some time for me but really honest conversations to say, you know what? You need to think about this different. This is how we should be doing it. And I didn't know. I was just being loving and happy and I was saying things totally wrong. And so having those really honest conversations I think are so important as we go out there. We do have a few chats and comments coming in.

And I first of all want to mention... We've mentioned it earlier, but Jennifer Stone is still very involved with National Women in Roofing. Like myself, she is a past chair. She was in the very beginning of forming National Women in Roofing. And she is listening today and makes me teary just knowing she's on here. But Jenny said that she wanted us to be sure to mention that there is help and guidance available to companies to work through Real Roofing. And so we're going to get to that a little bit more. But I wanted to say it now because it really is true. This is not something that's just like, okay, here and you're done. You go do your thing and figure it out. This is going to be something that National Women in Roofing with Mandy as... Mandy, you are the implementer, right?

Mandy McIntyre:

Program manager.

Heidi Ellsworth:

Program manager.

Ellen Thorp:

The host program manager.

Heidi Ellsworth:

There you go, okay. And so she's going to be there along with the other companies to help make sure that this is interactive and fun. And that it works for the company because we want people engaged. It's so important. And then we did have a question come in from Michelle. Hi Michelle, I'm pretty sure that's Michelle Kettering. Yeah. Ellen mentioned uncovering some unique situations that were specific to roofing. Can you share some examples of that, Ellen?

Ellen Thorp:

Yeah, so one of the unique situations is a woman who works for a contractor explained to us that she had some issues on her crew, with people from certain areas of Central America not wanting to work with people from other areas of Central America. They only wanted to work with people from their town, from their county, from their state. And the challenges that caused for so many different reasons, one, just them not trusting each other. And when you're not trusting someone, then that can develop into a safety issue. And so really then DEI education then becomes an important factor in your safety culture. We also had a situation or a story that was shared with us where there were some employers that just were not able to look at the unique attributes of their employees. That is not necessarily unique to roofing. But when you have an industry that has a labor shortage anyway, and then you've got people or employers not able to look at employees and support them in the ways that they need, specifically related to cultural celebrations, religious traditions, that affects being able to retain that employee.

And the converse is true as well. An employer showing true engagement and interest in their employees culture and religious traditions really can create a tremendous sense of loyalty in the company. And the DEI education that was out there just didn't address that areas of it. A lot of the DEI education out there looked only at more corporate sort of executive settings. And that just wasn't what we were working with. We're really grateful our consultant is Ron De Payne, with Flock Theory and we're really grateful that she was able to harness all of our ideas about things we wanted and things we didn't want. And help develop a framework and then content that really speaks to the roofing industry. One that's neat is in Real Roofing is the way the flow sort of works is there's like this intellectual education information. And then there's a story from someone in the roofing industry that shows the details, their lived experience as related to that industry.

And then the next day there's a new topic and there's educational or factual based information about that topic. And then the story of someone's lived experience in the roofing industry. And that was hard because we're then asking those people to relive painful moments of their life in order to educate the rest of us. It's not enough that you already had to be hurt in some way already. We want you to tell the story again for education, and that's not right either. And so we approach those very carefully because some people don't want to share their story again. And you know what? They don't have to. And we also know that hearing lived experiences is one of the things that can change their mind. So Mandy, did I explain that the right way?

Mandy McIntyre:

Yeah.

Ellen Thorp:

Okay. Is it performative justice? I think that's the word.

Mandy McIntyre:

Yeah, it can still qualify as that.

Heidi Ellsworth:

Yeah. Well-

Ellen Thorp:

Lots of thought went into many different elements.

Heidi Ellsworth:

Yeah. And I think it is good for people to share those stories when they want to. It is cleansing, I will say that. And it also empowers other people to be like, I'm not alone. Because I think that's the hardest thing, is when you're alone, you think I can't say anything. I can't talk about this. And I've had that experience for, well, how long have we been doing National Women in roofing? We've had so many people of all genders who have said yeah, this is my experience. And thank you for sharing because now I can share. And so these are the kind of things that will help your company when people in your company start understanding that it's okay to have these conversations, it will lift up your company across the board. I did want to just say from John Kenny, who is just amazing, he says, "Such great information you are getting out today. Change is always slow but this can be a game changer for our industry. Thank you for all your work on this."

And John, you're on a National Women in Roofing committee. You have [inaudible 00:39:15] consulting. And John, thank you for all you do. This is where we're going. I have another question here that I want to kind of bring Rae in, because what you're going to learn in Real Roofing, then I'm kind of guessing there's going to be times it's going to actually create more questions than answers because there'll be a lot of questions that come up into the company. And Rae, we were talking before about how do people educate themselves outside of this program? So from a DEI perspective, we don't even know... Especially when you're... Let's just be honest, when you're talking about Gen X and Boomers, sometimes they don't even know that they're not saying the right things or not being educated. So how do you recommend that people incorporate the Real Roofing, but then also outside of that, how can they continue to educate and grow their DEI awareness?

Rae July:

So I think a couple of things work. One is being open and honest and asking questions and just simply saying, I'm probably going to get this wrong. That's why I'm asking. So please pardon my ignorance and guide me. The other thing is the internet. The internet is there for a reason. If we utilize it the way we're supposed to, you're going to find the answers you need. I've done a lot of Google search when I was unsure of something, and I've talked to my peers if I had a question, especially around this time of the year. It's the holidays and not everyone celebrates Christmas. And so trying to understand, okay, how do I approach the subject with someone who is an employee and asking them, okay, do you celebrate Christmas? If not, what do you celebrate? How can we honor that within our office as we decorate? I refrain from saying Merry Christmas, I lean more towards Happy Holidays. I say things like, and if you celebrate the holidays, happy holidays to you because I want to be mindful.

And so it's open conversation. It's being willing to say, I don't know everything that's why I'm asking this question. And just using the internet.

Heidi Ellsworth:

Yeah, I think sometimes listening too. Just listen. And I listen to you ladies and I learn something all the time. And I take it home and I'm like, okay, how do I incorporate this into my life? Because I'm listening to people who are a lot smarter than I am who understand and who are committed to that passion. I think it makes a huge difference. I do want to share another comment that just came in and it's from Rhonda Payne. Yay. Rhonda says, "Thanks for the mention Ellen, the flock theory team love designing, producing, piloting, and launching Real Roofing. Conducting the real stories, interviews inclusively and working with the DEI committee and advisors allowed us..." This is really good, Rhonda, I am got to get my voice around this. So, "DEI committee and advisors allowed us to contextualize the program in a way that makes it unparalleled in the industry."

Wow, that's very cool there. There you are. So cool. Thank you for being on here.

Ellen Thorp:

I also like groundbreaking. Groundbreaking is good, unparalleled, yes.

Heidi Ellsworth:

Yeah. Lorna Rojas is on here. Another amazing lady works at Tramco in recruiting. So she knows her stuff. She's been really involved with National Women in Roofing. She says, "I think this program will help managers to gain some knowledge on how to develop cultural skills. Disconnection between managers and field staff is real." Mandy, I would love for you to talk about that because I think that's so true.

Mandy McIntyre:

Oh my gosh. Yeah, I think the pandemic really opened that up to see what a disconnect there can be between office staff and people out on the front lines. And so when you take that from a cultural standpoint, there's a gap. There just is. So it's learning to talk to your employees and treat your employees, and make sure that they feel just as included as everyone in the office because oftentimes messages or events or things that go on throughout the office, people out on the front lines or on the roofs they aren't experiencing that same culture. Oftentimes it's two separate cultures. So you have to maintain that universal company culture for both sides. And diversity, equity, inclusion, and not even from a racial or cultural, it's just on a human level taking these practices and putting them into play to have a more unified approach as a team.

Heidi Ellsworth:

Yeah. I have to share, a couple of years ago I had the honor of being at K Post. And K Post I was there to visit with them and they said, "Hey, come on out back and come celebrate with us." And they had their huge warehouse full of tables and they had mariachi band, they had beautiful, awesome food. And it was such a cultural celebration. And everybody from the field, like you're saying, Mandy, they were all in. They had shut everything down. Everybody was there, families were invited. And I know a lot of companies do this, but it was just so beautiful because it meant where the person was. Just like what you and Rae and Ellen are saying that it really celebrated the culture. And so I think that those kind of examples are so important to continue to push out there. So, go ahead.

Rae July:

Sorry. There's something I wanted to touch on. As we talk about diversity, equity, and inclusion. When people hear diversity, they tend to think it has to do with race. It's not always about race. Heidi, you talked about diversity of thought, diversity in age, those are things that are important too. I had someone ask me one time, they're like, "How can I diversify my staff when I operate in a predominantly white area?" And I said, "Okay, well, what is the average age of your staff?" And he said, "Well, they're in their 50s and 60s." I said, "Well, there's your problem. There's how you can diversify. What about people who are in their 30s and 20s and 40s, they want to work too." So when we talk about diversity, let's really be clear here, it's not just about the physical appearances that when it comes to race and necessarily gender. But it also has to do with things like age, and again, diversity of thought. If you work for an organization where everyone looks and thinks exactly alike, you have no diversity and you're not going to change, you're not going to grow.

Heidi Ellsworth:

Right. The diversity of thought I think is so important in our country right now, that we have respect for everyone and how they think. And I think Real Roofing is the step towards that because we may not agree with each other, but that doesn't mean we don't respect each other and we treat each other with kindness. And I see that actually in a very positive way in the roofing industry every day. I see people who have different ways of thinking, different religions, different parts of the country, different regions, but they all come together and support the roofing industry and celebrate each other. And so to me that's like, okay, we've got such a great base in the roofing industry. All we need to do is just keep adding more great people into it. So I think you're 100% right, Rae. We got to be looking outside that box and bringing more people of all types of diversity, and definitely diversity of thought because we only become better.

I know our company has and we have a lot of diversity of thought, let me tell you. So, okay, I can't believe how fast these hours go. We could just go on forever and ever. So I do want to just real quick, Rhonda, thank you. Thanks to the 60 people across cohorts one and two who took the course this year during our introductory phase. We talked about that earlier. They're called cohorts. These are all the people who watched it and gave feedback, which is totally cool. Your participation was awesome, vulnerable and generous. I know it made an impact immediately that we'll continue long-term. Delighted to be handing over the reins to you at Mandy for cohort three in January and beyond next year. So this is perfect. Thank you. Great transition because I want to take it to on, Mandy and let's get into the details. How do people get involved? What's the timeline? What's going to happen?

Mandy McIntyre:

Sure. So it's very user friendly. So our next... Okay, we have a webinar coming up on January 5th that's going to talk about all the details of the program. To sign up we have some links that I think will be coming up momentarily. It's a QR code for the links. But what you'll get is six weeks of content, three times a week you'll get a text or an email with a lesson that is 20 minutes or less. And it's a foundational approach to diversity, equity and inclusion. You're going to learn a lot of information. And we understand that there's going to be a lot of questions. So what we'll have is a weekly optional webinar that I will host where you can come bring your questions, and really discuss it in a group setting because it's individual learning. But we want this to be a collaborative approach to learning these topics.

And I'm so excited about it because it really is such a great program and it's very thought provoking but it's also very approachable. And I think no matter where you are on your DEI journey, whether you have taken some classes or whether you don't even know what DEI means, it's accessible for everybody wherever they're at.

Heidi Ellsworth:

That's excellent. So the first webinar is January 5th and the information is on screen. Megan is putting it in the chat. I think Mandy was going to put it in the chat too just so you can go register. And-

Mandy McIntyre:

And we launch on MLK Day. So if you want to register, which hopefully you do, we'll need you to do that before January 16th because that is when we launch this to the industry. And it is the pricing. So if you are a NWIR member, it is 199. The regular price is 399. There's some other levels for pricing, which are if you are an NWIR. NWIR sponsor, minority business certification, women owned certification for small business, you get that same discounted 199 rate. Which is we wanted to make it affordable to everybody within the industry, because I know a lot of other programs are much more than this.

Heidi Ellsworth:

Now is that per person or per company?

Mandy McIntyre:

Per person.

Heidi Ellsworth:

Per person, okay. And then you're going to have weekly webinars where people can attend through National Women in Roofing also. After they watch it, then they attend the webinar to have a discussion.

Mandy McIntyre:

Correct. And it's not mandatory as part of the program, but we wanted to have an open forum for people to come with their questions, because some of the topics they can be pretty heavy. And so if you have a question, if you have a story, if you need more explanation, then I will be there to help guide you. Aside from being the program manager and being on the DEI committee, I do have a certificate in diversity and inclusion from Cornell. So I am equipped to handle these questions. And I was just at a DEI conference. So I love this topic, I love talking about it. And I want to encourage people to have questions because a lot of times people are afraid to ask questions. But we have to be able to ask these things. We have to get beyond that fear and just talk about it in a psychologically safe space.

Heidi Ellsworth:

Yeah. So this QR code that we have up on the screen right now is where people QR it, take a picture, [inaudible 00:53:00] get your phone out, get your camera, and take a picture of it. And then they register to actually buy the course or to get notification to buy the course.

Mandy McIntyre:

Yes. So it has all the different links with that QR code to register for the course.

Heidi Ellsworth:

Perfect. Great. So last thoughts on this. And Rae, I would love for you to share some of your thoughts on the importance of this for people to incorporate in their business and kind of what you're going to do.

Rae July:

I think we covered a lot of ground on the importance of this program. Ellen talked about all the DEI programs that are out there. There's so many of them, but a lot of them focus more at the executive level. But the roofing industry now has a DEI program that is catered for the roofing industry. It's not a program that we're implementing that another industry uses. This is a program that was specifically created and catered for the roofing industry. So that's like the number one thing. Why wouldn't you want to be part of this if it's catered for you? And the other part of it too is just how much better it can make you as a leader, as a business, to be able to understand the meaning of DEI, how to properly implement it. And this program is not about making anybody woke.

It's about awakening your senses. That's what it is. We're not trying to have anyone become militant or anything like that. This is simply about awakening your senses, educating you, helping you understand how things affect people. Like Mandy said, words hurt and we say things and we think that okay, it's just a saying. But we don't realize the impact that might have on someone else who is of a different background, of different upbringing. And so programs like this really help. And I can't say enough about, I really firmly believe as on the contracting side, if you are a contractor and you take this program it is going to make you better. It is going to be better for your business. It is going to be better for you as a leader. So please don't hesitate. Do take this program. It is worth it, I promise you.

Heidi Ellsworth:

Excellent. Ladies, thank you so much. Thank you for all you've done. Ellen, thank you and the leadership. And Mandy, taking this to the next step. And Rae, as always, I have to tell you I'm humbled and so honored to have you all here. So thank you so much.

Rae July:

Thank you so much, Heidi.

Mandy McIntyre:

Thank you, yes.

Heidi Ellsworth:

And I do want to make sure that we thank Certain Teed again, thank you for being a sponsor. Thank you for leading. Thank you, yes. Thank you for really seeing the importance of bringing this into the industry. So Certain Teed, thank you so much for everything you do for the industry and for being a part of such an amazing program. And then I do want to let everyone know, well first of all, happy 2022 because this is our last Coffee Conversations of the year. It's been what an amazing year and we've had so many great things. I just can't believe it's over. So I want to wish all of you, if you celebrate the holidays, happy holidays, however you celebrate. Thank you, Rae, I took that one. Again, I learned every single time. And we want to invite all of you the second Thursday of January to join us with the International Roofing Expo. The keynote speaker, Luciano from KPost, talking about the Hispanic and Spanish, Latino.

So much going on that way at IRE talking about diversity and just all the great things that are going to be happening, including a live sound stage and live Coffee Conversations from RoofersCoffeeShop at IRE in March. So we're going to cover all of that in our January the first Coffee Conversations of January. So don't miss it. Be sure to register and we'll have all of that up on the site very soon. The other thing I also want to mention is that Certain Teed is our sponsor for the IRE page on RoofersCoffeeShop. So you're going to find out everything you need about IRE, what's happening? What everybody's doing? All the classes, the Education, National Women in Roofing Day, which is March... Ellen, March five, right?

Ellen Thorp:

Fifth.

Heidi Ellsworth:

March 5th, sign up for National Women in Roofing Day. Best thing you'll ever do for yourself besides Real Roofing. But all of that is going to be on the IRE page on our site, check it every single day. Certain Teed is our sponsor. They are the bomb and they're going to have a lot of great things happening at IRE too. So from all of us at RoofersCoffeeShop, we are so grateful. Thank you. Have a wonderful rest of 2022. And we will see you in 2023. Thanks.